You got that exactly backwards. You can’t “surrender” something that you have no immediate control over (because if you had, it would be personal property. But no one wants you to surrender your toothbrush).
Private property (and capitalism) needs state enforcement to exist.
All of those are things that you personally use, i.e. personal property. Contrast that for example to a house that someone doesn’t use and extracts rent from.
Capitalists made a good job in confusing these two concepts in every day use, similar to how they like to confuse capitalism with market-economy, or try to appropriate terms like libertarianism, which originally meant freedom from economic coercion, not freedom to economic coercion. It’s a cheap trick to make gullible people support capitalist interests.
No, you don’t have to turn over anything, why do you keep coming up with that strawman?
But if someone else would come and ask if they can use it since evidently you don’t, there is not much you could do about it other that asking them to voluntarily reimburse you for your costs ; and not a rent that over time pays your costs back many times over. The reason why the latter is possible in our society, is because the state (via the police) will violently evict people from houses they use but aren’t their private property. Hence for private property to exist there needs to be violent enforcement and only the state makes it legal to do so.
It’s an edge case scenario, but I wouldn’t call it a strawman.
What about in the case where my father dies. What happens to his house? Do I have to sell it? What if no one wants to buy it right away? What is the defining difference between personal property and private property? Because right now, it just seems like the difference is when you, or some arbitrary body of consensus, decides that someone else owns enough stuff.
The strawman is that you assume someone would go around and actively take things away from you. This wouldn’t be the case. Rather if other people have an urgent need for it and you don’t, then, and only then would this situation happen.
But distinction is clear: regular usage. Nothing arbitrary about that at all.
If you don’t plan to use the house of your father, someone else should start using it, especially if there is a housing shortage. Common politeness would of course mandate to wait for you to finish grieving the death of your father and allow you to remove any items of purely sentimental value from the house first.
Simple as that. Why would you, who likely spend no effort at all in building or maintaining the house of your father have any special rights?
Why would you, who likely spend no effort at all in building or maintaining the house of your father have any special rights?
By this logic, why should any outside party who absolutely didn’t put any effort in to the property get to claim it?
[The] distinction is clear: regular usage. Nothing arbitrary about that at all.
What counts as regular usage? This didn’t answer the question, it just kicked the can down the road a little way. Who or what determines when my property transitions from personal to private?
No the logic is the age old “from each according to their ability, to each according to their needs”. They get to claim it as personal property if they have a need for it and actually live in it.
But it is very easy to determine regular use in all but some edge cases where the established previous user would get preference due to customary rights. And your personal property can’t transition to private property, as private property wouldn’t exist.
But lets assume you are right and it is difficult to determine. What would you rather have? Some disagreements over the use of a garage between neighbors, or wide scale violent enforcement of private property for a few that claim ownership of hundreds or thousands of houses? Because that is what you are defending here, and by doing so you are the useful idiot of the capitalist elite.
You got that exactly backwards. You can’t “surrender” something that you have no immediate control over (because if you had, it would be personal property. But no one wants you to surrender your toothbrush).
Private property (and capitalism) needs state enforcement to exist.
So, uh, who do I turn over the deed to my house and title for my car to?
How am I getting to work on Monday? And where am I going to sleep?
All of those are things that you personally use, i.e. personal property. Contrast that for example to a house that someone doesn’t use and extracts rent from.
Capitalists made a good job in confusing these two concepts in every day use, similar to how they like to confuse capitalism with market-economy, or try to appropriate terms like libertarianism, which originally meant freedom from economic coercion, not freedom to economic coercion. It’s a cheap trick to make gullible people support capitalist interests.
Gotcha.
So if I converted my standalone garage into a MiL suite, would I have to turn it over?
No, you don’t have to turn over anything, why do you keep coming up with that strawman?
But if someone else would come and ask if they can use it since evidently you don’t, there is not much you could do about it other that asking them to voluntarily reimburse you for your costs ; and not a rent that over time pays your costs back many times over. The reason why the latter is possible in our society, is because the state (via the police) will violently evict people from houses they use but aren’t their private property. Hence for private property to exist there needs to be violent enforcement and only the state makes it legal to do so.
It’s an edge case scenario, but I wouldn’t call it a strawman.
What about in the case where my father dies. What happens to his house? Do I have to sell it? What if no one wants to buy it right away? What is the defining difference between personal property and private property? Because right now, it just seems like the difference is when you, or some arbitrary body of consensus, decides that someone else owns enough stuff.
The strawman is that you assume someone would go around and actively take things away from you. This wouldn’t be the case. Rather if other people have an urgent need for it and you don’t, then, and only then would this situation happen.
But distinction is clear: regular usage. Nothing arbitrary about that at all.
If you don’t plan to use the house of your father, someone else should start using it, especially if there is a housing shortage. Common politeness would of course mandate to wait for you to finish grieving the death of your father and allow you to remove any items of purely sentimental value from the house first.
Simple as that. Why would you, who likely spend no effort at all in building or maintaining the house of your father have any special rights?
By this logic, why should any outside party who absolutely didn’t put any effort in to the property get to claim it?
What counts as regular usage? This didn’t answer the question, it just kicked the can down the road a little way. Who or what determines when my property transitions from personal to private?
No the logic is the age old “from each according to their ability, to each according to their needs”. They get to claim it as personal property if they have a need for it and actually live in it.
But it is very easy to determine regular use in all but some edge cases where the established previous user would get preference due to customary rights. And your personal property can’t transition to private property, as private property wouldn’t exist.
But lets assume you are right and it is difficult to determine. What would you rather have? Some disagreements over the use of a garage between neighbors, or wide scale violent enforcement of private property for a few that claim ownership of hundreds or thousands of houses? Because that is what you are defending here, and by doing so you are the useful idiot of the capitalist elite.