Did they update the page since you commented? I see kw and kg on there… 🤷

Now latest testing of an even lighter 12.7kg version on a more powerful dynamometer has shattered this record, with a staggering 750kW (>1000bhp) short-term peak rating, resulting in a new unofficial power density record of 59kW/kg

They’re based in the UK, they have no excuse.

I’ll give them some credence based on the cars their motors are already used in and the fact that their parent company is Mercedes-Benz. Doesn’t look like they’re a bunch of grifters seeking investment.

But, how much is that in baby elephants?

That’s how EVs started! Sorta.

This is from a Porsche in 1900:

And some 2000s EVs tried it. But it’s impractical.

• It increases unsprung weight, e.g. weight not cushioned by suspension. Bad for ride/handling/steering feel.

• All that vibration is HARD on the motor. Read: unreliable.

• Motor is more exposed to temperature/dust. Again, reliability.

In reality, a decent suspension needs a lot of room under the body anyway. An axle to get the motor in the body is dirt cheap on the rear, and still pretty cheap on the front, and you could just mount this thing sideways to make it flat…

That would be a lot of unsprung weight.

Handling and ride quality are dramatically and negatively impacted by every bit of weight that is not held up by the suspension. That’s why higher performance cars will have lightweight wheels. Rather than steel wheels you see on lower performance cars.

It’s better to just put all the heavy drive components inboard on the chassis and run drive shafts to the wheels.

You see motors in the hubs of bicycles, because they really don’t go that fast. So even if the bike has a suspension, it’s not that big of a deal. Motorcycles on the other hand would need to keep any heavy parts inboard.

PS

One issue I hadn’t thought of is putting traditional brakes (which generate a ton of heat) right next to the motors. Again, we’re just asking for mechanical issues here, and we’re ballooning unsprung mass to mitigate it, especially in heavier cars that take a lot to stop.

The entire floor pan could just be one thin battery, and everything above it could be passenger and storage space.

This seems like a minor thing, but the control electronics for the motors takes up a nontrivial amount of space. So do “traditional” subsystems like hydraulics, climate control, or an old fashioned car battery (which often exists in parallel to the EV drivetrain).

Theres also safety to consider. A traditional sedan “hood,” even a small one, is easier on standing pedestrians, so it hits their legs and they flop on top, instead of slamming them like a wall (as a bus-like front would).

Aptera wanted to do this with their flagship Solar Electric Vehicle (SEV).

IIRC, they switched to an outwheel motor because of the weight the inwheel motors added to the wheels. Could be wrong tho

Hub motors are a party trick. They will never reach mass market in a car.

This is already pretty close to how many EVs are designed.

Except for the fact that that much power would need massive batteries. So your thin small battery would be dead the first time you mashed the peddle to the floor

Yep, I noticed that, you’re right. And that’s near-miraculous efficiency. The maker’s website sez: “YASA also estimates that its all-important continuous power will be in the region of 350kW-400kW (469bhp-536bhp).” It also sez: "To achieve a 750kW short-term peak rating and a density of 59kW/kg … " Devi’ls in the details … The image on the ‘superblondie’ page shows A LOT of cooling built into whatever metal that is: https://supercarblondie.com/wp-content/uploads/YASA-tiny-electric-motor.webp

I mean an ICE output more heat than power. So a 150kW ice engine requires like, 200kW heat dissipation ?

Ebike would probably fold in half from the torque lol

It only does that at peak for a few seconds, practically, about a third that power.

Maybe we can also have them drive themselves and link them up for more efficiency also have them as a service so not everyone has to own their own and we can reduce overhead on servicing and infrastructure and … trains.

Make them stone tracks, because steel is too expensive, then make the wheels of gum, because steel wheels have too less friction. Then you have a street and a car.

Electrics produce maximum torque at 0 rpm …

I’m assuming the efficiency is similar to other electric motors. Maybe not the best, but likely acceptable. If it’s not, the product is DOA.

If my assumption holds true, it would allow for lighter cars and better packaging by making even more room for the battery near the bottom of the car since these engines are so small, you could easily just use one per driven wheel and forget about differentials and such. And hybrids that put the motor in a ZF 8HP transmission could have wayyyyy more power available from the electric bit, as space is sorta constrained there.

I think trains could also benefit from a weight loss IF these are durable enough. They have multiple motors usually.

Weight is important in vehicles not just because of energy efficiency, but because the more sprung mass you have, the more work the suspension needs to do. And unsprung mass is even worse, so ideally your motors are sprung mass. Currently weight is still a bit of an issue for EVs due to the batteries, but if they can make up for it a bit by having super light weight motors, the difference between EV weight and ICE weight becomes smaller. Weight is also super important to road wear, I think it is by 4th power. So 20% heavier means twice as much wear already.

Weight will help with efficiency. If you got to tow around less weight, you can go for longer.

YMCA NASA colab would’ve been lit though

Trains don’t benefit much from lesser weight.

Drones, and planes are the most likely to benefit from this.

China