But you can make cheese out of it and cheese is life.
Cheese is death
Vegan cheese exists. It is easier to make, is much healthier and animals do not have to suffer.
Vegan cheese exists
Yeah, but it’s shit.
I’ve tried vegan cheese… It’s gross dude.
It doesn’t even taste like old cow titties and animal suffering. 0/10
Would you argue in the same way for slavery or child labour?
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Cows aren’t human
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Dairy cattle can be happy
Hope that helps.
Cows aren’t human.
Sooo? They are thinking and feeling individuals. Or do you imply that basically anything can be done to beings, when they are not human?
Dairy cattle can be happy
So could be slaves and/or exploited children. But would that make it right?
It’s appalling to even imply the existence of a happy slave.
Would you be happy with dairy farming if the cows didn’t have brains but we’re just headless bags that worked with an autonomic nervous system only?
If so it’s a question of degree.
Personally: I’ve interacted with cows sufficiently to see they don’t compare to a cat in intelligence, and I have issues with people keeping cats.
Cows are some of the dumbest creatures we’ve domesticated - second only to sheep.
I don’t think they should be abused but I don’t think they’re being abused by giving dairy.
I’d be fine with them being brainless. I’m fine with them being nigh unto brainless as they are now.
I’d be fine with them being brainless
So, I’m not 100% getting where you are going with this argument, but I think what you are saying is: If beings have less brain capability they are less worthy of being treated with the same respect as beings with higher brain capabilities. And ultimately, that it would be OK to kill beings that have less brain capabilities.
I don’t think they’re being abused by giving dairy.
Could you spell out for me what is needed for a cow to give milk? Because I think we need to clarify “what actually happens” to cows in that process in order to classify something as abuse or not.
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Yes. Just like you don’t have any qualms squishing ants.
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Very aware of dairy cows and the veal industry. Also aware that herd animals do not give a single fuck about their young.
- By that logic, you would also have no problem in killing people with lower brain capabilities - like people with dementia or mentally challenged people.
- Demonstrably not true and I don’t get where you would pick up such a false bit of information.
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No because I can tell a cow from a person.
So do you think that we should be allowed to do anything we want to non-human beings, or should there be a limit for that?
There should be some limits, sure. But but comparing it to slavery or forced labour is just silly anthropomorphising.
OK, cool. So where do you think the limit should be?
(Also, was not a comparison but an analogy. But that doesn’t really matter, does it?)
Well, that’s an extremly complex questions and there are many cases to consider and personal opinion on these can vary a lot.
For example one of the least limited cases should be animal testing for medical purposes. There should still be limits, but they have to be carefully decided by weighing the potential benefits against the suffering caused.
Another prominented case would be factory farming. I think that’s quite bad and also makes for a poorer end product. But I don’t think there is anything fundamentally wrong with keeping livestock for eating it. But the details of how regulation should work exactly are again quite complex and beyond the scope of a lemmy comment.
You know you’ve succeeded with a truly unpopular opinion when you get more downvotes on Unpopular Opinion while no one is complaining that it is a popular opinion.
Diets are pretty intrinsic to how people live. This is the equivalent of an edgey atheist teenager shitting on Christianity as an unpopular opinion.
It is an interesting picture you are painting and true, it is probably how most people would see it.
However, your comparison with religion is a little bit off. Engaging in religion is (and should be) a personal choice that is just including you - i.e. it should not force or be forced by others.
But by choosing to consume animal products, you don’t just choose something for yourself - you are forcing someone else into pain and ultimately death.
That is the reason why “vegans are so annoying”. We don’t give a crap about what YOU do - but we want to stand in for the victims that can’t make themselves be heard. I hope this makes it easier to understand our motives and why we feel the moral obligation to act on them.
Have a good one!
I could lay out an argument that supporting religion means you support slavery and crusades.
I’m not going to engage your false utopia. Human brains literally developed from agriculture and cattle farming. Reality is meat consumption is a need for the majority of the planet and beyond an individual consumers’ responsibility to solve.
You choose to live on each day despite knowing you will consume and pollute inherently, yet seek to criticize the choices of others?
Human brains literally developed from agriculture and cattle farming
If if this was true, this doesn’t prove that it is still necessary or even beneficial today. Humans did a lot of things in the past that would be seen as strange today (you already mentioned crusades for example). It does not follow that, just because “we did it in the past” means we still need to do it today.
meat consumption is a need for the majority of the planet
I don’t fully agree. Please give me circumstances where there would be a NEED for this.
Are you suggesting we start keeping human women on farms to milk them? Do you really want to go to the store and buy a bottle of breast milk to pour over your cereal?
LMAO
Soy milk is better alternative. If you don’t like the taste, try coconut milk, oat milk, almond milk, cashew milk, etc.
If I use milk in anything it’s usually oat milk, but I still like things like cheese and ice cream sometimes
There are vegan versions of those too, they’re just less common.
There’s no good vegan alternative to cheese. I tried a couple and they all taste like shit.
My honest tip would be: Just forget that something like cheese even existed and eat something else. Even I (as a full time vegan) don’t really like the “cheese” we have - but since I just don’t eat anything “cheese-like” anymore, I’m really not bothered to be honest.
Do you really want to go to the store and buy a bottle of breast milk to pour over your cereal?
But… that is EXACTLY what people are doing?! 🤷 Maybe not from a human, but still from a mother.
The lactose intolerant agree with you
Don’t drag us into this
It’s too late!
*sound of black hole sucking you up*
A truly unpopular opinion, congratulations
And at some point in the future, it will be truly popular! 😁
Factory farming sucks and should be abolished.
That being said, in ancient times they gave us milk and we gave them grain during winter. Contracts can always be revisited, but don’t act like this was entirely one sided.
I guess you haven’t seen a cow in your life.
Cows need to be milked to stay healthy, because they will still produce milk after her calf is weaned.
They don’t need to be impregnated in a rape rack though
This is the only opinion an empathic human beeing should have. 👍
