Follow up question; do you believe that Ukrainians, as a nation, are entirely comprised of idiot children?
Because it seems to me the absolute height of arrogance to decide that the Pope, or any other political or spiritual leader, has the right to tell them whether or not its acceptable to fight for their sovereignty.
So please, do explain to me if you can, why you feel that your opinion on whether or not they should continue fighting matters more than theirs?
You used so many words to tell us that you’re utterly ignorant of the subject you’re opining on here. Let’s take a look at a few slides from this lecture that Mearsheimer gave back in 2015 to get a bit of background on the subject. Mearsheimer is certainly not pro Russian in any sense, and a proponent of US global hegemony. First, here’s the demographic breakdown of Ukraine:
here’s how the election in 2004 went:
this is the 2010 election:
As we can clearly see from the voting patterns in both elections, the country is divided exactly across the current line of conflict. Furthermore, a survey conducted in 2015 further shows that there is a sharp division between people of eastern and western Ukraine on which economic bloc they would rather belong to:
Ukraine is clearly not some homogeneous blob, but a large country with complex cultural and ethnic situations.
And of course, let’s not forget how the regime the west installed in Ukraine has been abusing people of Donbas, there’s even a whole French documentary on the subject
Which is a lot of words to say that you genuinely believe you know what they want better than they do.
No country is a monolith, but ultimately if a nation’s leadership is not representing their people, that is an issue for the people of that nation to resolve.
Unless you’re proposing that “spreading democracy” to other countries in order to install the government we think they should have is actually a good idea?
Nah, I just know a lot better than you do because I’m not the one pretending that the regime in Ukraine represents the people there. The democratically elected government that represented the people in Ukraine was overthrown back in 2014 in a violent coup backed by the west. Ukraine is literally a product of the west “spreading democracy”.
Ah, of course. You know better because you know better. A tautology that no one can ever disprove. But should anyone dare to suggest that this position is a touch arrogant, they deserve to be ridiculed and insulted.
No, I know better because I bothered to spend the time to educate myself and I provide sources to support what I’m saying. Meanwhile, you just spew baseless nonsense.
Which is a lot of words to say that you genuinely believe you know what they want better than they do.
Who is this “they”? The Ukrainian oligarchs and their far-right government that are conscripting men to fight their war for them? The Azov Nazis? Or the regular working people just trying to live their lives?
Follow up question; do you believe that Ukrainians, as a nation, are entirely comprised of idiot children?
Because it seems to me the absolute height of arrogance to decide that the Pope, or any other political or spiritual leader, has the right to tell them whether or not its acceptable to fight for their sovereignty.
So please, do explain to me if you can, why you feel that your opinion on whether or not they should continue fighting matters more than theirs?
You used so many words to tell us that you’re utterly ignorant of the subject you’re opining on here. Let’s take a look at a few slides from this lecture that Mearsheimer gave back in 2015 to get a bit of background on the subject. Mearsheimer is certainly not pro Russian in any sense, and a proponent of US global hegemony. First, here’s the demographic breakdown of Ukraine:
here’s how the election in 2004 went:
this is the 2010 election:
As we can clearly see from the voting patterns in both elections, the country is divided exactly across the current line of conflict. Furthermore, a survey conducted in 2015 further shows that there is a sharp division between people of eastern and western Ukraine on which economic bloc they would rather belong to:
Ukraine is clearly not some homogeneous blob, but a large country with complex cultural and ethnic situations.
And of course, let’s not forget how the regime the west installed in Ukraine has been abusing people of Donbas, there’s even a whole French documentary on the subject
https://yewtu.be/watch?v=bN68OfFKaWs
and there’s HRW statement on Ukraine using cluster munitions in Donbas as early as 2014 https://www.hrw.org/news/2014/10/20/ukraine-widespread-use-cluster-munitions
Just a couple of examples of what was going on prior to 2022.
Which is a lot of words to say that you genuinely believe you know what they want better than they do.
No country is a monolith, but ultimately if a nation’s leadership is not representing their people, that is an issue for the people of that nation to resolve.
Unless you’re proposing that “spreading democracy” to other countries in order to install the government we think they should have is actually a good idea?
Nah, I just know a lot better than you do because I’m not the one pretending that the regime in Ukraine represents the people there. The democratically elected government that represented the people in Ukraine was overthrown back in 2014 in a violent coup backed by the west. Ukraine is literally a product of the west “spreading democracy”.
Ah, of course. You know better because you know better. A tautology that no one can ever disprove. But should anyone dare to suggest that this position is a touch arrogant, they deserve to be ridiculed and insulted.
No, I know better because I bothered to spend the time to educate myself and I provide sources to support what I’m saying. Meanwhile, you just spew baseless nonsense.
Who is this “they”? The Ukrainian oligarchs and their far-right government that are conscripting men to fight their war for them? The Azov Nazis? Or the regular working people just trying to live their lives?
What percent of the Ukrainian force is volunteer vs conscripted?