• Johanno@feddit.de
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    8 months ago

    I as a german asked an expert on that topic. Chatgpt. According to chatGPT there is no genocide if you don’t kill them with the intention to wipe them from the planet. So if for example you drop accidentally poison into their water because you mixed the Botox and sugar bottle in the water station then even if they all die it is not a genocide.

    And since chatgpt is infallable this is the only truth.

    • amzd@kbin.social
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      8 months ago

      Except that basically all Israeli politicians have made statements saying they have genocidal intentions.

        • amzd@kbin.social
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          8 months ago

          The charge document includes quotes of expression of genocidal intent by the following state officials:

          • Prime Minister of Israel
          • President of Israel
          • Israeli Minister of Defence
          • Israeli Minister for National Security
          • Israeli Minister of Energy and Infrastructure
          • Israeli Minister of Finance
          • Israeli Minister of Heritage
          • Israeli Minister of Agriculture
          • Deputy Speaker of the Knesset and Member of the Foreign Affairs and Security
            Committee
          • Israeli Army Coordinator of Government Activities in the Territories (‘COGAT’)
          • Israeli Army Reservist Major General, former Head of the Israeli National Security
            Council, and adviser to the Defence Minister

          You can read the actual quotes in the application document in chapter D.

    • Raykin@lemmy.world
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      8 months ago

      Upvoted but I wish you would have run your post through ChatGPT as well my friend. That was hard to read.

        • Johanno@feddit.de
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          8 months ago

          I could use german grammar to set the commas, but then I would have probably 10 to many for English grammar. So I tend to use less in English.

        • KISSmyOSFeddit@lemmy.world
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          8 months ago

          Comma rules in German are logical and follow set rules. When I asked my English teacher about comma rules in English, she said she’s not teaching them cause they’re too complicated.
          When I asked my English teacher during my foreign exchange year in the US, she basically said the same.

          • Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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            8 months ago

            As a native English speaker, I barely understand comma rules either. The only person I know that I would expect to always get commas right has a Master’s degree in English. The extremely oversimplified rule I was taught as a young child was to add a comma anywhere you would naturally pause while speaking. Doesn’t always work, but it works well enough.

        • verdigris@lemmy.ml
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          8 months ago

          None of those sentences needed commas, they’re just not constructed very clearly.

          • brbposting@sh.itjust.works
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            8 months ago

            I, as a German, asked an expert on that topic: ChatGPT. According to ChatGPT, there is no genocide if you don’t kill them with the intention to wipe them from the planet. So, if for example you accidentally drop poison into their water because you mixed the botox and sugar bottle at the water station, then even if they all die it is not a genocide.

            And since ChatGPT is infallible, this is the only truth.

            Six commas, colon, capitalization, word order, word choice, “infallible”. Infallible like my editing 🤓 & dunt u disagreeme

            PS: I speak zero languages (rounded), good job all who learn English and attempt to use it

            • verdigris@lemmy.ml
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              8 months ago

              Okay, yes, those are all valid places to put commas, good job – except for the one after “So”, which actually decreases the legibility. It would be better to surround “for example” with commas.

              However, none of them are grammatically necessary. The original comment is totally fine and can be parsed unambiguously as-is. I would support the colon insertion above any of your commas.

              • brbposting@sh.itjust.works
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                8 months ago

                Good point!

                Interesting, anywhere I can read about grammatically necessary vs. recommended yet unnecessary commas? (Perhaps on the first search result for that question heh)

                • verdigris@lemmy.ml
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                  8 months ago

                  This is a decent article, at least for the most part: I actually don’t like their examples for the “Preposition of Time” stuff at all, the versions with commas are just bad writing.

                  But basically it just comes down to whether the sentence/clause can be parsed unambiguously without the commas. There is no syntactical difference between “I as a German asked…” and “I, as a German, asked…”. It’s entirely a style choice.

    • Kusimulkku@lemm.ee
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      8 months ago

      Yeah, genocide often requires intent. So I guess this could be more of a massacre than a genocide.

      But there’s quite a few different definitions, some are more lax.

      • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        Except for all the politicians, from shutzstaffel commanders to the (Hitler apologist) PM’s PR guy saying exactly this, using words like cexterminate’ ‘wipe from the earth’ ‘every last one’ and many individual storm troopers posting on their social media (in videos while doing war crimes), or even their ‘civilians’ frequently saying it

        Edit: nevermind. It wasnt a press guy; their pm.said it himself. Of course it did.

        • Kusimulkku@lemm.ee
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          8 months ago

          I really doubt their aim with this thing is to destroy all the Palestinians, but if you can provide those quotes that show that that’s their stated aim then I’d definitely consider this a genocide.

            • Kusimulkku@lemm.ee
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              8 months ago

              I was thinking the ones in the above reply but it doesn’t have to be very many at all if it’s the top people saying it. PM, DM, generals (that sort of people) saying their goals are extermination of Palestinians seems like it’d make the case pretty clear.

              I’m sorry if you see asking for sources as goalpost shifting but my goalpost was that there should be intent shown (because that’s a common genocide definition I think). It hasn’t changed. Asking for source is just basic thing on online discussions. It’s not a personal thing against you.

              • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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                8 months ago

                How many. Give me a number. IMO case is already so obvious you need special glasses to look directly at it and keep your eyes. So tell me how many high level and how many low level (probably nsfl) sources would work.

                If Theres a ‘might convince me’ range and a ‘this is so fucking obvious how could I have missed this?’ Range, feel free to include that.

                • Kusimulkku@lemm.ee
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                  8 months ago

                  Uhh, let’s say five? Is that alright?

                  I’m sorry I didn’t first see that you had edited the comment. I don’t know what would be a solid number for “this is obvious”. I guess it would depend on what is said by who. But I guess if you want some sort of hard number then let’s go with five top level comments or something? Would that work?

                  • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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                    8 months ago

                    Here’s one article from January with more than five incidents, though only four from separate named top level sources. These aren’t ambiguous or off record; these are what south Africa’s lawyers are taking to the UN world court. (Prime minister, deputy head of parliament/head of dominant party, defense minister, ‘heritage minister’ whatever that is) https://www.huffpost.com/entry/israel-rhetoric-palestinians-south-africa-genocide-case_n_65a94997e4b041f1ce65175e

                    Heres another article from about the same time about the same thing, also cites a 5th top level named source (adding finance minister) https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-south-africa-genocide-hate-speech-97a9e4a84a3a6bebeddfb80f8a030724

                    So that’s five (more? Didn’t scroll down farther in AP article) cabinetish level genocidal shit geysers in literally the first two search results.

                    And as a fun bonus, here’s the kinds of songs they have their children sing: https://www.palestinechronicle.com/we-will-annihilate-everyone-in-gaza-israeli-children-song-calls-for-destroying-gaza-video/

                    Taking a loooooooong-ass shower now, so sorry about slow reply.

                    The thing about fascism is: every accusation is a confession. Every last one. I know, you’re thinking the dumb version of ‘he who fights monsters’ (having never read Nietzsche), but that was Hitlers entire strategy with ‘the big lie’; to turn his storm troopers into exactly the thing he accused his victims of being, and then use shit libs like you as his defense. And it worked for a really fun king long time. Read a book (though maybe not his. Plenty of scholars of fascism out there can explain it better than i!) .

                    They aren’t human. They weren’t born this way, and denying that is denying their autonomy. They’ve said they won’t stop, short of being killed, or that ‘nothing will stop us’. There is one way to stop this genocide, and if you didn’t care about saving the Palestinian people, you’re a fucking bad faith liar for saying there is anything disallowed to do to kapostanis. They need to die. Their ‘culture’ (which is literally just atrocities and shit they pillaged. Bet you can’t even get a decent bagel or pastrami sandwich over there)

                    And lol, using grammar or immediate ‘fuck wrong button’ edits to pretend I said totally different shit

      • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        Teeeeensy nitpick: there are two definitions of genocide that have ever mattered. Two. Not many. Two.

        Lemkins original, much much broader, definition, And the one you’re familiar with, adopted by the UN because like everyone on the permanent security council thing had an interest in the definition being a little more narrow. Under which the way the Palestinian people are being exterminated absolutely still counts.

        Interestingly, by lemkin’s broader definition, making the shutzstaffel stop killing Palestinians might constitute a genocide of the kapostanis; it would be destroying every trace of their culture, and the means of its reproduction.

        • Kusimulkku@lemm.ee
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          8 months ago

          I didn’t say there were plenty “that have ever mattered” so it doesn’t seem like a nitpick towards me.

          • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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            8 months ago

            I’m sure your high school had its own? Doesn’t count.

            There are plenty of abbreviations. But those aren’t separate content; just condensed versions.

            There are two.

              • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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                8 months ago

                If Theres ever a genocide against a group I know includes you,I’m going to laugh at it so hard.

                Which is probably going to get me kicked out of a lot of ‘stop the genocide’ stuff.

                • Kusimulkku@lemm.ee
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                  8 months ago

                  If Theres ever a genocide against a group I know includes you,I’m going to laugh at it so hard.

                  Weird.

                  • melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee
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                    8 months ago

                    Yeah I’m not gonna look totally cracked and it’s gonna be all your fault, I hope it occurs to you to feel bad about making me laugh at such an inappropriate time while you’re starving to death, because it was not a nice thing to do.

    • A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world
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      8 months ago

      To meet the legal definition of genocide, you also have to have the intent to destroy a particular group of people. So, legally speaking, your example isn’t genocide according to any source.

      I don’t know the motives behind the Israel/Palestine conflict or how it started, but if it doesn’t involve an intent to destroy Palestinians specifically, I guess I could see how GPT’s take is valid. Like, the war in Ukraine is egregious too, but that by itself doesn’t make it a genocide.

      • DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafe
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        8 months ago

        Deliberate displacement of particular ethnic or religious groups is also recognized as genocide, in particular because it’s often a pretext. ChatGPT is wrong, and needs to read the UN definition.

      • nonailsleft@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        I don’t know the motives behind the Israel/Palestine conflict or how it started

        Religion

      • letsgo@lemm.ee
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        8 months ago

        How it started: the Ottomans sided with the Nazis, so when they lost, the Ottomans also lost their land and the Allies got it, following the usual war rule where the winner wins the land. Dividing up the land is where the British Mandate for Palestine came from, under which we gave 2/3 of the land to the Arabs (Transjordan) and 1/3 of the land to Israel. But the Arabs refused to accept this and started the first of a series of wars against Israel. The Arabs, now also partially known as Palestinians, have continually refused to accept any peace deal, starting wars whenever possible and so far losing every one of them. Israel has repeatedly accepted peace deals, even at the cost of land, but it only works if both sides agree, which they don’t: the only deal the Arabs want is all the land and no Israel, which also means no Jews (proof: look at the Jewish communities within existing Arab states (TLDR: non-existent or shrinking)), which means the Arabs are hellbent on a genocide of all the Jews, and are determined to achieve that or die trying.