- cross-posted to:
- retrogaming@lemmy.world
- games@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- retrogaming@lemmy.world
- games@lemmy.world
You can play it in your browser here.
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On another forum, I was complaining about how Microsoft was planning to remove WordPad from Win11. I was advised that installing OpenOffice or LibreOffice was an appropriate replacement. I replied that WordPad was only 3 megs large, as opposed to the recommended replacements, which are decidedly larger.
I guess not everybody appreciates tight code, but I surely do. Things like this are amazingly impressive.
Appreciates tight code
Runs Windows 11
Pick a lane, son.
Appreciates tight code
Proceed to run a 13KB Javascript game in a browser.
Brother, look up kolibri os, then you’ll see some TIGHT code
AmigaOS 1.3 or bust.
I will die on this hill.
Menuet OS it is for me
Anyway don’t install OpenOffice for any reason, just pick libreoffice or onlyoffice. OpenOffice doesn’t get a functional/security/compatibility update since 2014.
I don’t particularly care about code size as a user or as a programmer.
Hard drive space is the cheapest thing you’ve got on a computer.
You could always run gentoo and use -Os … that can make things a lot smaller but also slower.
Sometimes a program is slow to start up because it’s so boated that just loading it from the disk takes multiple seconds. Wasting a few kB doesn’t hurt anything, but if you’re doing it thousands of times in one program, your users are gonna have a bad time.
What was it again, 1 critical bug every 1000 loc?
That’s why, code as much as needed but as less as possible.
Of course not measured in KB, because readable code takes a bit more space than clever hacks.
Counting in lines of code is the most stupid metric.
Code is rarely the biggest thing in these programs. You want textures that don’t look stretched and pixelated at 4K? That’s going to cost you.
Look in any game directory. There’s probably a one big file–sometimes a few big ones–in there that you can rename to .zip and unpack it as one. It will dump all the textures/sound effects/etc. in the game, but have zero code. It will be something like 70-90% of the game’s entire space.
I agree and disagree.
Yes, in Games. There, the longer the more, duplicated assets too (like, all the data in every level package, even though every level only needs 10% of the data). Because user storage is cheaper than optimization.
Sometimes in tools too, often crappy tools with abundance of animations. But usually it’s cheaply made software in a framework dragging lots of boilerplate with it. There it’s loc again.No, not in office suites and Wordpad.
Btw, why is vector graphics so rarely used for simple icons?
I just looked at how big LibreOffice Writer is, 210 MB as a portable app… Wow…
AbiWord Portable is probably the smallest and even that is 15 MB installed…
I was gonna say notepad but I just looked and its 18mb. granted I have a few plugins installed though.
Size doesn’t matter much when you have SSDs that read upwards of 5000mb/s. It’s why we’re seeing an advent of web-based apps despite them being woefully inefficient, and why games regularly go above 100gb. The reason file size gets so large is that assets can take up a lot of space and they come with plenty of libraries that they just have to bundle. These “small size” software optimize for size at other costs, like speed, asset quality, development time… Reducing file size is just not relevant anymore and if anything you should be wary of software that do it.
yeah, you know what?.. no. This is the kind of attitude that got us here to begin with. Yes, processers get faster, and yes size gets more available. But that shouldn’t be an excuse for poorly-written code.
An empty Microsoft Word document is larger than the first word processing program I ever used. That is just crazy when you think about it. but “oh people have lots of resources they’re not even using so it doesn’t matter”, right? When companies have this attitude of “oh the resources are there I may as well use all of them for myself” then their code runs like garbage and you need a faster computer just to make it work halfways decently. And because of this we all end up on this goddamned technology treadmill where we have to keep buying bigger and faster and more expensive computers to do the same thing the old computers did just because the programs written for it are too bloated and the people writing the code couldn’t be arsed to make it work well. It wastes our time and our money. I reject that. I think others should too.poorly written code and tight code
This is where you guys lose me, it’s just code that not optimized for size and that’s because most people don’t give a shit about that. People want want their 4k assets, their localization, their accessibility features, their application to run on any device… All this comes at a cost. You want to change things, that’s fine, but start by understanding why things are the way they are because shitting on developers won’t get you anywhere.
Fuck developers.
- Steve Ballmer
If you’re old enough, then the first word processing program you ever used was probably on a screen 640x480 pixels or smaller, didn’t support internationalization, couldn’t provide true WYSIWYG to match output between the screen and a printer, and couldn’t render fonts with anti-aliasing. Which of these features would you like to drop to reduce the size?
Everyone loves “tight” programs until they realize what they have to give up to make it work.
Fonts can be handled by Windows itself.
I don’t care about internationalization, just EN-US is good enough.
Having more pixels doesn’t change asset sizes when the pixels used per asset are the same. Just show me the smaller button or use vector graphics.
Reminds me of kkreiger, an fps with impressive graphics and sound for the time, that weighed in at 96KB.
A long time ago I came across a game that was part of a 1mb challenge. It’s called A New Zero. I played it quite a lot, just flying around and dive bombing boats was entertaining enough for me.
I was impressed with 1mb but 13kb and 96kb is pretty amazing. I really enjoy seeing stuff like this.
Nice I have been thinking about doing a either an 8mb or 5mb gamejam challenge but I wasn’t sure if 5mb would be to low but if there are 1mb challenges I guess it does not seem to impractical. Also I am going to test that game out in wine it looks interesting.
kkreiger is more impressive to me, because it creates itself on execution time. While this 13kB game is willfully ignoring the fact that the average web browser today is already a 2GB behemoth. While kkeiger is pure C++ and it does the whole thing, including the game engine and sound processor and everything else.
Is definitely not pure c++. It’s making use of direct x and even fonts available in Windows to create textures.
Without DirectX or OpenGL you’d have to create a GPU driver or do CPU rendering…
kKrieger was always kind of amazing to see. Even understanding a little bit about how the game works, it’s still kind of mind-boggling
This is crazy!
I have so many questions, but lack the technical know how of how to ask them.
Instead of actually storing images, sound files, maps, etc, whole program relies on algorithms computed at runtime. Level generated automatically, sound follows a set math pattern with randomization, etc etc
Benefits of less file size but more processor requirements
Oh yeah. I can remember back in the day it could take quite a bit to compile and start these things, especially if you were running at higher resolution and detail values.
Basically it’s all procedurally generated assets. It takes a long time to start to because it has to make all it’s textures and sound effects.
Check this video out by Nostalgia Nerd
Here is an alternative Piped link(s):
https://piped.video/bD1wWY1YD-M
Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.
I’m open-source; check me out at GitHub.
How much of that is third-party libraries, and/or third-party hosted? Obviously the assets (images and music) aren’t being counted.
The whole page transferred about 7kB and shows 18.2kB of ressources according to the debug tools.
The game also requires a renderer (browser) to play.
I think what they did is impressive but the claim about the size feels like taking source code and saying “look how small on disk it is”
It is js, it is always source code.
Except if it’s minified for production.
That is still source code, obfuscated but still source code.
Not sure about GreaseMonkey, but V8 compiles JS to an IL.
Nodejs has an emit IL debugging feature to see the emitted IL code.
This is amazing for only 13KB.
And I was blown away the ps1 game Vagrant Story turned Into 90mb file as a chd.
That said one of the games I enjoyed most even when I had an Amiga was a 48k ZX Spectrum game called Chaos.
I did not know that I needed loderunner-quake in my life.
Thanks for posting.
Online multiplayer?
deleted by creator
