Man that is weird. Thank you for the link; I have such mixed feelings.
On the one hand, yes I think it makes a ton of sense to vet your userbase if you want to cultivate a particular sort of discussion (i.e., you want thoughtful comments vs shitposts and memes). OTOH, the response reads like a “For WUSSIES ONLY” want ad. It’s the internet dude, toughen up a little. For the same reason, HOLY SHIT how do you have an instance without downvote? You can’t curate content on moderation a lone. But then, maybe that’s why they are defederated.
That is such a weird take. People go and create a space deliberately aimed at making people feel more welcome than on the rest of the internet, and you come and shit on it because… Why? Are people not allowed to create and seek out spaces where they’re at least semi-protected from the bullshit greeting them everywhere else? Or do you feel entitled to interact with everyone on the internet however you like, regardless of their needs, and are upset to find out that sometimes, you can’t?
I’m glad for you that you don’t have the need for a place like beehaw, but other people sometimes just want to take a break from all the bullshit, and they have every right to do so, even on the internet.
“Nobody needs to listen to your crass and entitled take on safe spaces; think of their needs! Here is my entitled and intentionally provocative take on YOUR take, fuck your needs stranger.”
Fortunately, this is not beehaw so we can have this enlightened exchange of ideas.
There’s no irony here, that’s exactly how it’s supposed to work. My point is not that every space on the internet needs to be as protected as beehaw. My point is that it’s valid for people to create and seek out spaces like beehaw if they feel like it, and to be protective of them, which you didn’t seem to understand. But of course it’s just as valid to not need that and engage in the kind of argument we’re having here right now, because different places can have different rules, and that’s totally fine, as long as you respect the rules of whatever place you interact with.
I’m not in beehaw, I’m out here in a reality-based internet forum. I see why people might want something protected, but that doesn’t make it less weird to me, and it IS totally fine to think that it’s weird.
Beehaw is to Lemmy (or any open forum on the internet) as planet fitness is to fitness. It’s idealized and safe to the point that it no longer really fits in it’s category. You can make the internet nice the same way you can get fit on bagels and donuts while walking the track: by pretending.
Nothing is wrong with pretend, but if you ever watch LARP you’ll understand that it’s strange to come across in the wild when adults do it.
What are you even talking about. The people on beehaw are not trying to pretend that the internet as such is nice. They are creating a community with a specific code of conduct, and that is just as real as any other place on the internet. You can still talk about shitty stuff, and you can have dissent, conflict and discussion on there, nobody pretends that that all doesn’t exist. The only requirement is that you approach with respect and well-meaning by default for everyone around, there’s nothing else to it. On the contrary, I feel like people who don’t want to follow these rules are the ones pretending - pretending that they’re not interacting with real people, that anything they say doesn’t affect others.
You seem to be under the impression that any “nice” space must be fake, because, I don’t know, people are inherently not nice, or something, and thus everyone must be just pretending? That’s a pretty sad way to view the world, and absolutely not true in my experience. I know plenty of great places and communities made of people that just genuinely want the best for others by default, both online and offline, and it takes no pretending, it only takes a bit of caution to keep the very few people out that are not there to participate constructively and can’t or don’t want to clear the pretty low bar of respect and well-meaning.
What, can’t take getting kicked out of the care bear club, tough guy? Their tiny wussie banhammers too much for you? Go ahead, downvote me, show everyone ALL your power!
I don’t get it? I’m happy to chat and be called a retard or whatever. Downvotes also fine. I just like to chat / argue/ debate.
I don’t care about beehaw specifically. The post here says something like even one negative experience can take a huge amount of effort to undo… Really? Is it all that serious on the internet?
I’m not trying to bait you or be shitty or anything. Why does it matter so much?
Different people take things different ways, some have been taking shit all their life, some are at a breaking point, some are already broken and trying to pick up the pieces.
If you haven’t experienced any of that, then congratulations, you’re one of the lucky and/or young and/or sociopathic ones. Go out there and have fun! Break a leg, lose a finger, get mauled, set your hair on fire, get drowned, have people you trusted call you names dozens of times a day for a couple decades, get abused, beaten down… and when you’ve had enough, go on the internet.
Stuff isn’t “all that serious on the internet”, it gets serious IRL.
After that, some people go on the internet and don’t feel like taking even the slightest extra bit of shit, so they don’t participate, communities degenerate exponentially, leaving behind only memes and shit flingers, a corpse full of “tough guys” where any serious debate is dead before arrival. Not a problem if you have ads or sell blue checkmarks though!
To avoid that, Beehaw has a single main rule: be nice. Don’t know how to chat/argue/debate while being nice to each other? Well, there is your chance to learn, the community will be glad to help if you’re serious. Or just hop on and unwind for a while. If you try to stir shit up though, you get shown the door.
Sounds like a fine reason not to federate with beehaw to me. If you need a space to be safe safe, you’re better off not having people like me close to it.
The Beehaw admins made this choice, and documented their rationale here: https://beehaw.org/post/567170
Man that is weird. Thank you for the link; I have such mixed feelings.
On the one hand, yes I think it makes a ton of sense to vet your userbase if you want to cultivate a particular sort of discussion (i.e., you want thoughtful comments vs shitposts and memes). OTOH, the response reads like a “For WUSSIES ONLY” want ad. It’s the internet dude, toughen up a little. For the same reason, HOLY SHIT how do you have an instance without downvote? You can’t curate content on moderation a lone. But then, maybe that’s why they are defederated.
That is such a weird take. People go and create a space deliberately aimed at making people feel more welcome than on the rest of the internet, and you come and shit on it because… Why? Are people not allowed to create and seek out spaces where they’re at least semi-protected from the bullshit greeting them everywhere else? Or do you feel entitled to interact with everyone on the internet however you like, regardless of their needs, and are upset to find out that sometimes, you can’t?
I’m glad for you that you don’t have the need for a place like beehaw, but other people sometimes just want to take a break from all the bullshit, and they have every right to do so, even on the internet.
Can you not smell the irony here?
“Nobody needs to listen to your crass and entitled take on safe spaces; think of their needs! Here is my entitled and intentionally provocative take on YOUR take, fuck your needs stranger.”
Fortunately, this is not beehaw so we can have this enlightened exchange of ideas.
There’s no irony here, that’s exactly how it’s supposed to work. My point is not that every space on the internet needs to be as protected as beehaw. My point is that it’s valid for people to create and seek out spaces like beehaw if they feel like it, and to be protective of them, which you didn’t seem to understand. But of course it’s just as valid to not need that and engage in the kind of argument we’re having here right now, because different places can have different rules, and that’s totally fine, as long as you respect the rules of whatever place you interact with.
I’m not in beehaw, I’m out here in a reality-based internet forum. I see why people might want something protected, but that doesn’t make it less weird to me, and it IS totally fine to think that it’s weird.
Beehaw is to Lemmy (or any open forum on the internet) as planet fitness is to fitness. It’s idealized and safe to the point that it no longer really fits in it’s category. You can make the internet nice the same way you can get fit on bagels and donuts while walking the track: by pretending.
Nothing is wrong with pretend, but if you ever watch LARP you’ll understand that it’s strange to come across in the wild when adults do it.
What are you even talking about. The people on beehaw are not trying to pretend that the internet as such is nice. They are creating a community with a specific code of conduct, and that is just as real as any other place on the internet. You can still talk about shitty stuff, and you can have dissent, conflict and discussion on there, nobody pretends that that all doesn’t exist. The only requirement is that you approach with respect and well-meaning by default for everyone around, there’s nothing else to it. On the contrary, I feel like people who don’t want to follow these rules are the ones pretending - pretending that they’re not interacting with real people, that anything they say doesn’t affect others.
You seem to be under the impression that any “nice” space must be fake, because, I don’t know, people are inherently not nice, or something, and thus everyone must be just pretending? That’s a pretty sad way to view the world, and absolutely not true in my experience. I know plenty of great places and communities made of people that just genuinely want the best for others by default, both online and offline, and it takes no pretending, it only takes a bit of caution to keep the very few people out that are not there to participate constructively and can’t or don’t want to clear the pretty low bar of respect and well-meaning.
What, can’t take getting kicked out of the care bear club, tough guy? Their tiny wussie banhammers too much for you? Go ahead, downvote me, show everyone ALL your power!
(Hi, this is my non-beehaw alt.)
Keep licking the boot!
Removed by mod
I don’t get it? I’m happy to chat and be called a retard or whatever. Downvotes also fine. I just like to chat / argue/ debate.
I don’t care about beehaw specifically. The post here says something like even one negative experience can take a huge amount of effort to undo… Really? Is it all that serious on the internet?
I’m not trying to bait you or be shitty or anything. Why does it matter so much?
Different people take things different ways, some have been taking shit all their life, some are at a breaking point, some are already broken and trying to pick up the pieces.
If you haven’t experienced any of that, then congratulations, you’re one of the lucky and/or young and/or sociopathic ones. Go out there and have fun! Break a leg, lose a finger, get mauled, set your hair on fire, get drowned, have people you trusted call you names dozens of times a day for a couple decades, get abused, beaten down… and when you’ve had enough, go on the internet.
Stuff isn’t “all that serious on the internet”, it gets serious IRL.
After that, some people go on the internet and don’t feel like taking even the slightest extra bit of shit, so they don’t participate, communities degenerate exponentially, leaving behind only memes and shit flingers, a corpse full of “tough guys” where any serious debate is dead before arrival. Not a problem if you have ads or sell blue checkmarks though!
To avoid that, Beehaw has a single main rule: be nice. Don’t know how to chat/argue/debate while being nice to each other? Well, there is your chance to learn, the community will be glad to help if you’re serious. Or just hop on and unwind for a while. If you try to stir shit up though, you get shown the door.
Sounds like a fine reason not to federate with beehaw to me. If you need a space to be safe safe, you’re better off not having people like me close to it.
The world isnt nice. Neither am I :).
It works both ways, really. You don’t want to be close when a nice guy snaps.
Safe spaces are not just to feel safe from you, they’re also to keep staying nice.