There is a difference between “you believe what they say” and “you can’t tell if they are lying.” The sense motive roll’s outcome only says whether or not they can tell if another character is lying; not even what the lie is or have anything to affect their personal belief. He might know the cleric is a bad guy; he just can’t prove it.
And he can think whatever the fuck he wants about that, which is entirely my point, because he, as a theoretically sentient being, is aware that he is flawed.
Unless there’s a character driven reason not to! Arrogance, naivete, backstory, whatever.
But, more pressingly, my point is to make you aware that there are more options available to the system for Deception checks than pure statblock measuring! And every table should be aware of that!
As well as the fact that Persuasion and Deception are not mind control.
Which I’m still not convinced you are, because this argument is still going.
As well as the fact that Persuasion and Deception are not mind control.
No fucking shit. I agree with that, my argument is that knowing the truth and believing it are two different things. It doesn’t affect their beliefs or motivations; it’s a god damn lie detector test.
At this point I can only come to two conclusions: You either don’t have a strong grasp of English or you are willfully not reading what I am saying.
It’s a particularly interesting example you’ve chosen given that lie detectors are fucking pseudoscience and a specific character might not believe one single fucking thing they say
There is a difference between “you believe what they say” and “you can’t tell if they are lying.” The sense motive roll’s outcome only says whether or not they can tell if another character is lying; not even what the lie is or have anything to affect their personal belief. He might know the cleric is a bad guy; he just can’t prove it.
And he can think whatever the fuck he wants about that, which is entirely my point, because he, as a theoretically sentient being, is aware that he is flawed.
Unless there’s a character driven reason not to! Arrogance, naivete, backstory, whatever.
But, more pressingly, my point is to make you aware that there are more options available to the system for Deception checks than pure statblock measuring! And every table should be aware of that!
As well as the fact that Persuasion and Deception are not mind control.
Which I’m still not convinced you are, because this argument is still going.
No fucking shit. I agree with that, my argument is that knowing the truth and believing it are two different things. It doesn’t affect their beliefs or motivations; it’s a god damn lie detector test.
At this point I can only come to two conclusions: You either don’t have a strong grasp of English or you are willfully not reading what I am saying.
And
A
Player
Can
Decide
They
Do
Not
Care
What
The
Lie
Detector
Says
Or
How
It’s
Calibrated
It’s a particularly interesting example you’ve chosen given that lie detectors are fucking pseudoscience and a specific character might not believe one single fucking thing they say