- cross-posted to:
- world@quokk.au
- cross-posted to:
- world@quokk.au
This is not about me or the others from the flotilla. There are thousands of Palestinians, hundreds of whom are children, who are being held without trial right now, and many of them are most likely being tortured, says Greta Thunberg.
What we have been through is only a small, small part of what Palestinians have experienced. On the walls of our prison cells, we saw bullet holes with bloodstains and messages carved into the walls by Palestinian prisoners who had been there before us.
When I’m about to get off the boat, there are a bunch of police officers waiting for me. They grab me, pull me to the ground, and throw an Israeli flag over me.
Greta Thunberg describes how she is dragged to a paved area fenced in with iron fences. This is a protracted scene that lasts for over six hours, according to Greta, and is confirmed by several participants in the flotilla that Aftonbladet talks to.
It was kind of dystopian. I saw maybe 50 people sitting in a row on their knees with handcuffs and their foreheads against the ground. They dragged me to the opposite side from where the others were sitting, and I had the flag around me the whole time. They hit and kicked me.
They moved me very brutally to a corner that I was turned towards. ‘A special place for a special lady’, they said. And then they had learned ‘Lilla hora’ (Little Wh0re) and ‘Hora Greta’ (Wh0re Greta) in Swedish, which they repeated all the time.
The flag was placed so that it would touch me. When it fluttered and touched me, they shouted ‘Don’t touch the flag’ and kicked me in the side. After a while, my hands were tied with cable ties, very tightly. A bunch of guards lined up to take selfies with me while I was sitting like that.
You must log in or # to comment.
A bunch of guards lined up to take selfies with me while I was sitting like that
Really says a lot about the IDF and Israel that they’re always so excited to document the horrible things they do. They’re taking pictures so they can show other people. They think other Israelis - their friends and family - will be excited to see pictures of someone being treated horribly. Reminds me of Rachel Corrie and how they found her murder so funny they’d make pancakes with her face on it. What kind of person celebrates murder like that, and what kind of society allows such public celebration of it?
She’s a non-violent protestor. Why do they take so much joy in being violent to her?
The IDF loves recording themselves committing war crimes, and posting them on telegram.
A sick society that promotes cruelty starting even with their children.
Israelis are sick fucks. Their country is the Nazi Germany of our time. How ironic. Their ancestors are likely spinning in their graves.
And yet she’s braver and more courageous than any Israeli will ever be.
I have to say I’ve been on fence about her in the past but she is willing to put herself in there to bring attention to the issue. Having said that if she goes back they will kill her. She isn’t dealing with decent human beings. She is dealing with the type of people who poisons people in ‘showers’ and makes those they let live shovel the bodies in to furnaces. Of course they have a word for people who express that reality. It used to mean something but their repeated misuse of it have made it meaningless.
Readind that article makes me… I don’t know. I’m not ‘mad’, I’m fucking restless. First, the torture, sure. We knew the current* Israeli government is monstrous. (*I don’t know about all the previous ones, I’m not versed in Israeli history.) But the response from the Swedish embassy?
And, after all that, what’s the response of the world? Similar to the Swedish government response as shown here. Evasive, absolutely unwilling to stand up to the monsters. Being monsters themselves by proxy.
I feel like I must act, but know not what to do. I’m restless. I feel like our world is stuck in some kind of non-Newtonian liquid made of Capital, Hunger for Power and Gutlessness. I feel like I want to round up all those monsters, ship them on an island and make sure there’s no way out - have fun amongst yourselves, monsters. I know this isn’t realist. I know not what to do. Calling my minister here in Canada doesn’t do shit - our government is as gutless as all others. Standing in the street hasn’t done much either, nor participating in event in support of Gaza and the wish to put an end to the massacre and torture of a whole people.
‘I have no mouth, and I must scream’
"What we have been through is only a small, small part of what Palestinians have experienced. "
Say what you will of Greta, but her ability to remain humble is truly admirable.
She is tough as nails.
Yeah she is. She’s hella brave.
Honestly want her to be the Secretary General of the UN. Someone needs to push our international government bodies to be more assertive when dealing with human rights.
She’ll get there. There’s still tempering to be done that comes with more experience and age which benefits and strengthens a political position.
I look forward to it.
I put zero weight in age. Right is right. Wrong is wrong. Age can be a bad thing when older generations got us here.
Age can be a bad thing when older generations got us here
What exactly does that mean?
Older generations created the problem. Expecting them to fix the society they built is a fools errand. Even the most progressive older generations aren’t willing to emancipate all of humanity.
If they do this to a person they know the world is watching and will hear from, think of how much worse it is for the untold nameless gazans taken hostage by Israel.
Regardless of what you think about Palestinians, it’s trivial to see that the Israelis are bad guys in this conflict.
Usually, the world is shades of gray, like with Palestinians, so it’s sort of a relief when you can just point to somebody and say, “Well, those guys are clearly the bad guys, and anybody who supports their actions is also bad.”
Unfortunately, all the Israel bots need to do is say “Hamas” and suddenly everyone thinks Israel is a victim.
Bad people can also be victims. They are not mutually exclusive ideas. In fact, it’s quite likely that bad people are disproportionately victims. They do something horrible to somebody else, and those people do something back. Sometimes, it’s simple justice or comeuppance, and other times, it’s escalating violence between two groups of detestable people.
Hurt people hurt people.
Israel adopted the victim mentality a long time ago. Yes, they were victims of the Holocaust and yes, the world had treated them like shit for thousands of years.
The thing is that they adopted their victimhood unequivocally and then became like the spoiled child who knows how to manipulate their ‘parents’ to get what they want. And it’s worked.
There was a time when Israel at least tried to act like a nation of people who wanted to grow, but since Netanyahu and his right-wing alliances took power Israel has become no better than Hamas – using genocidal violence to lead.
There’s plenty of Jews out there who saw what Israel would have to do in order to reach their goal of being a Jewish state from the beginning and wanted nothing to do with it. Plenty of Holocaust survivors at the time were very explicitly against the taking of land from a pre-existing population, and understood that to make it a Jewish state you’d need to remove the people there… somehow.
Some Rabbis have even made the argument that even attempting to form Israel in the first place is heretical.
Anti-zionist Jews have been a thing for as long as Zionism has existed.
Plenty of Holocaust survivors at the time were very explicitly against the taking of land from a pre-existing population, and understood that to make it a Jewish state you’d need to remove the people there… somehow.
Do you have an example in mind? Enough people survived that I had assumed this, but then again plenty ended up in Israel as well.
The religious arguments against were definitely a thing, and it took quite a bit of propaganda to get the Sephardis to care either way, since most of the drama was in Europe.
the world had treated them like shit for thousands of years.
More like just Europe. Pre-Roman Jewish history reads pretty similarly to the history of their neighbors. In the Muslim world some stuff happened, but the religions actually agree on a lot, and I’d guess the other various minorities got it worse. In Christendom they were kind of the only group to punch down at, so it got really bad. The Roman period is complicated, and I’m not sure how much is even recorded about the more far flung diasporas.
This is exactly the message messing with Greta was meant to convey. Look what we did and nobody will punish us for it. We will do much worse to you and nobody will care. They are behaving like 1930’s Nazis. Untouchable and unaccountable.
We already have human rights reports about it . You don’t have to imagine
Even then, I assume it’s like the last holocaust and it’s even worse than the reports.
Yep, we almost always find out the worst shit many years after it happened. And I’m pretty sure the absolutely worst stuff just never comes out.
I think she should have kept teaching people about climate instead of picking a side in this conflict.
I don’t think she cares what you think.
Because you care more about trees than brown people being genocided?
Oh you’re nothing without vegetation (“trees”). Without the aquarium, you have no fish at all. But also, we each have our specialty and hers was climate (not really just “trees” as you think).
Well there you go, from the horse’s mouth, they roughed her up at least a little. That’s pretty bold, now she can make hay of it.
I know she wants to stay humble and keep the focus on Palestinian suffering, but it’s important everyone on the flotilla share their experience at the hands of the Israelis.
Every person needs to return to their home country to speak on the depravity of the Israelis and their treatment of foreign nationals to highlight their cruelty and the horrors they inflict upon the population that’s 100% under their control and every whim, who the world has ignored for decades. Of the children held in those same cells deprived of food, water, bedding and often subjected to sexual abuse by both male and female guards.
I believe so too. Greta probably also extra fears being seen as an attention grabber because so many Israeli bot accounts are accusing her of doing it for personal fame and calling it a selfie cruise.
This article is a perfect way of her starting off by making everyone aware that this is happening far worse to Palestinians while also spreading the awareness and I’m glad they finally published it.
Little removed
Does Lemmy.world remove curse words, now, or was that just you? The fuck 😂
At the same time the Swedish equivalent was not censored.
Lilla hora = little whore
If that was not obvious
It probably got caught in my .ml potty word filter. I’ll try bypassing the regex check
lemmy.ml has a slur filter
That’s more than just a slur filter if it’s filtering out whore. Are we not adults? Why the fuck are we acting like children that would be irreparably damaged if we so much as read a naughty word?
idk, I’m an adult and I don’t mind it
Even the comic-book bullies are better than this… The sad part is that the West will continue to lick the boot, hoping everyone will just forget. I really hope that that is not the case. What Greta did here is very impressive, and I hope that her spirit will inspire other young people to vote out these dumbfucks in government that try to do damage control in this situation.
France, UK, Canada, Spain and a lot of other Western countries recognized Palestine as a country. That is a pretty clear sign of the reputational hit Israel has gotten due to the Gaza genocide. Politicans in the West understand that supporting Israel is no longer free, but comes with a massive price tag.
And poor billions into pro-Israel propaganda.
And weapons.
Why are certain countries so obsessed with flags?
pathetic.
The world would be a much better place if we took the concept of countries and removed the borders. Then we can start getting over the whole US and THEM thing, which isn’t helping us to move on from our petty ideologies and prioritise advancing us as whole planet.
To this day, individuals are making their own fake borders when they can’t seem to get their own borders created
I’m sure that the concept of “us” and “them” outdates the concept of countries.
If we got rid of countries then the people over that hill or across that river would become “them”.
Yep. It’s fair to say countries are in the way, but it’s not the whole game.
Right, but then rich people can no longer exploit other regions if everyone is considered equal! Think about the shareholders for a bit :/ (I’m sarcastic, in case it is not clear :D)
The main problem here is that people flocking to positions of power are often the ones that do it for the wrong reasons. Until that part is sorted out, we will keep having leaders that will enforce things that are best for them and their closest ones. Some form of anarcho-communism would probably help this, but the current globalisation effort will make it very hard to implement. The best thing we can do as individuals is to just improve our social circle, and try to rely on as many local things as possible.
we can start getting over the whole US and THEM thing
Unfortunately the “us and them thing” is an evolved aspect of human society. It’s not possible for humans to get past it because it’s literally in our DNA.
The Righteous Mind by Jonathan Haidt discusses this in detail.
Maybe? I feel like there’s at least been pockets of history where we successfully resist it, so I have hope. Like, where I live right now, seriously hating any reasonably self-contained group is taboo and the exception.
If we really can’t overcome it somehow, the rest of history is going to be at least as hellish as the past, and there’s nothing we can do about it.
But… Open borders?!?
*Clutches pearls *
This is an admirable goal but we are very, very far from it becoming a reality for a whole host of reasons.
So what? We should just settle for the status quo then?
Obviously not, but maybe we should focus on more tangible goals at the moment like stopping an active genocide, stabilizing American politics, and quelling the billionaire problem at the moment.
I expect eating the rich will solve all of the above :)
Nationalism and the flagshagging that comes along with it have always been baffling things to me.
Not sure if you’re serious, but flags (aka standards) were THE most important part of the crusades 1.0 (my mom’s surname comes from a standard-bearer’s heroics not letting their flag touch the ground in a battle)
Not saying it means fuck all, but you’re witnessing a watered down version of the same in this fisher price version of the crusades.
Standards weren’t exactly flags in the modern sense, which IIRC started in the early modern era, but it’s the same idea.
It’s a replacement for morals
Removed by mod
The state of Israel is behaving like Nazis, not “Jews”.
And nothing - especially not other people acting like fascists - legitimates supporting a man who systematically executed millions on the basis of religion and ethnicity.
Yep. That Israelis happen to be Jewish should be a lesson in how no ethnicity is safe from falling into this.
Going by the username and followup, OP is just an open neonazi, though.
Removed by mod
Literally, not all Jews.
Actually, not even the majority…
Hmm. Do you know if there’s been a poll of the diaspora? There’s pretty strong motivators to look the other way when people like you do something bad, and I’ve kind of assumed I’m outnumbered.
Zionists are nazis and not sll jews are zionists
