- cross-posted to:
- games@sh.itjust.works
- cross-posted to:
- games@sh.itjust.works
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I hope this doesn’t make them think they can do this again though. This should make them realise they should’ve always gave the Devs more time to cook or been more realistic with scope from the get go
A publicly traded company prioritizing consumer satisfaction over short term profits? Learning from their “mistakes” after they still got a shit ton of money for it anyways and probably will if they do it again? I’m not banking on it.
People already seem to forget this isn’t the first time, the release of Witcher 3 was horrendous as well.
Geralt’s flowing locks caused Nvidia cards to crash comes to mind.
I’m not so sure we’re talking about the same scale of horrendous here.
It being released in a essentially a beta state with a terrible UI? half the loot being a bitch to access because you always cast igni? Game breaking bugs and glitch’s? Hard crashes?
I don’t think they have released one game that was actually release ready yet.
CP2077 was far worse, but that doesn’t mean the Witcher 3 was okay, it was still absolutely botched.
CP2077 was far worse, but that doesn’t mean the Witcher 3 was okay, it was still absolutely botched.
This is literally a rewording of what I just said.
Sounds more like downplaying the severity of one.
I’m not downplaying anything, but comparing a dumpster to a dumpster fire and saying they are the same thing is, at best, a little misleading.
The release of Witcher 3 was bad, but it was industry standard bad. Cyberpunk shipped straight up broken and incomplete. It has been fundamentally reworked at least twice since launch.
I don’t think anyone is apologizing for The Witcher 3 at launch, but let’s not pretend they are the same thing. There are more shades than black and white.
Strangely enough, I didn’t have any game-breaking bugs or crashes and I played it at launch. I guess I was lucky.
I had the quest glitch where you could no longer progress the story. It was also in the later 25% of the game, so 80ish hours in.
Lol I was gonna say
What a naive and unrealistic outlook on how the world works
But you already said what I was gonna say but smarter
But they can, because it seems like most gamers have goldfish memory, and they forgot/forgave the shitty launch and first years
My thought coming into this thread. Plenty of people here sucking their dick and forgetting the terrible launch. They earn what they deserve.
i bought into it and hate that its getting so much praise.
fixing the garbage they released is bare minimum.
I still think this game is shit since I was subjected to the release version and haven’t picked it back up ever since.
Fuck this game and the management that fucked it all up.
And steam reviews prioritize reviews over the last 30 calendar days…
In my experience it was much less buggy at launch than for example Elder Scrolls: Oblivion. I didn’t experience any game-breaking bugs, just ones that harmed immersion. There was a bit of T-posing, the occasional floating prop/animation bug, and once I got launched into the desert when climbing through a window. No crashes to desktop, no broken progression. It probably helped that I was happy with the game they delivered rather than getting hung up on what may have been promised.
bethesda games are known to be shit and buggy since forever and they mostly don’t even fix em after years it’s just how they operate . which isnt something ppl should normalize even sea-dogs / not developed by them - morrowind - oblivion all had these issues bethesda is really not a rolemodel on these things
Yes, just wanted to contrast the reception they got. Bethesda games don’t generally attract as much ire for the bugs. People expect them and tolerate them (to an extent). Cyberpunk 2077 was a totally broken mess according to the internet, while the Elder Scrolls are the greatest thing ever.
I had crashes to the desktop about every 4th area transition in Oblivion and it still didn’t bother me too much, since it had just saved and took less than a minute to get back into the game.
Some bugs - even total crashes - can still be put up with just fine.
Because bethesda ( unfortunately ) got grandfathered in to making very good open world games FULL OF BUGS AND kinda got away with it undeservedly so ( kinda like how pokemon gets away with making mediocre games coz they were the first . like imagine call of duty ( as shit as they are ) making 2 versions of games and sellling you different weapons on each and you gottta payy 140 dollars :D if you want full content. but ppl are kinda waking up starfield was criticized more than their last games etc… ( id say cyberpunk was still worse than most elder scroll games though ( but still totally agreee with you different fan bases treat games differently both arent ok.
Anecdotally, I feel like there is some survivorship bias going on here. I’ve seen plenty of complaints about Bethesda bugs over the years, but people that are truly bothered by it (me!) have sworn off all their games and thus have no reason to talk about them anymore. The only ones left playing are those that still have some enjoyment/respect for Bethesda games. Cyberpunk felt like more of a “mainstream” hit so it makes sense there was more backlash.
What I think is astonishing to some people lately about Cyberpunk, is that they got most of their information from the popular channels on the internet. Despite its name, these channels (reddit r/all, Twitter, etc) are a (loud) minority of the actual opinions.
Pretty much every one I talked to IRL about Cyberpunk was aware of the controversy, but had a much more nuanced opinion than I was seeing online. Many of them enjoyed it and weren’t really experiencing that many bugs (myself included). But this wasn’t an “allowed” opinion online. Anyone who said the game was enjoyable or they didn’t personally experience many bugs were attacked for being a CDPR fanboy (myself included) and down voted.
Winning in the end absolutely means they will do it if this was the most cost effective method.
There’s no chance this won’t happen again IMO (though since they abandoned their own engine maybe it won’t be as buggy this time).
The distributers that set the rrlease date will never learn.
Honestly though, I believe the early issues with the game were mostly on consoles. On a decently specced PC, the game would run nicely right after launch, with some bugs, but nothing game breaking. I got it right after launch day and enjoyed myself quite a bit with it. The police and the way the cars drove were the things that bothered me the most.
I remember hearing even some high specced pcs were having issues and you had to essentially be lucky that you had a configuration that they had the time to optimise for. Just having the best gpu wasn’t enough, for example
thats was just a loud minority talking about super max setting with Raytracing and 4k
Weren’t they specifically advertising for that? The criticism is valid if they were.
Not that I remember, true that it didn’t handle the last gen consoles, and that it was marketed as quite demanding
Sadly “minimum” or “recommended” just tells us the game runs, not that it runs well
Recommended is absolutely meant to be “the game runs well on this” not just it runs
The thing is what is the consensus of “runs well”? Is it a FPS constant? No glitches? Fast loads?
My point is, a game can come shitty and run a constant 30 fps under the “recommended” since that’s what they thought was appropriate
Is a gray area that should be more descriptive, not sure why downvote me
I had a decent AMD card which ran it very well, but still had a bunch of artifacts like Judy’s head blocking reflections for the whole lake.
True, though that shouldn’t give anyone dev or publisher the right to release a broken game on consoles because it works on PC. Either postpone the PC release date until the console issues are fixed, or release as a PC exclusive until the same. Part of the reason the game was so successful with phantom liberty is that they stopped previous gen console work so they could only focus on hardware that could actually support the game. As with many devs, their partnerships fucked them, getting pressure from Sony, MS, and Nvidia to release the game before it was a polished product
You’re certainly right about that!
I tried playing on the lowest possible settings with a 1070 and averaged around 14fps :/
I still finished the game because it was awesome, but haven’t revisited it ever since.
And what CPU
It’s an AMD Athlon!
Totally fine for gaming in 2024.
I don’t remember it being that bad on my 1070 mobile laptop (8th gen Intel i5 H if I’m not mistaken), but it was sub 25 fps also. On my PC it ran better, but after upgrading to a 3080 with a 5800X3D was when it ran smoothly at higher resolutions, although the game also had received some updates by then.
I played it on a pc that was ok at the time and the physics engine glitched out so things that were supposed to be sitting still on top of/next to each other would randomly collide and sometimes fly off. Still had fun with the game though.
I had some cars that were following an invisible road above where the real road was a few times, and although that broke immersion a bit, I also still had a lot of fun with the game.
I might actually bother getting it now.
It’s kind of ridiculous nowadays that games are released, and then developed afterwards.
Honestly you gotta have that mentality now when buying games.
Yep, only buying games after they go on discount couple months after release. By that time, the game is usually also finished
Weren’t they pushed into releasing the game early?
Yeah, upper management at CDPR ignored the devs who told them the game wasn’t ready to ship yet, but they really wanted to take advantage of the new market of players staying home and playing video games after covid first hit.
That short-sighted money grab cost them so much in the long run. It’s actually insane to see CDPR’s redemption arc play out after how badly they handled the launch.
Cyberpunk was in development for atleast 12 years, I agree that corporate needs to be hands off when it comes to things like that, but at what point is there a line drawn and you just have to publish what you have got.
Could be 20 years, for all I care. Let them cook. It’s done when it’s done.
No. That’s called Star Citizen, and it’s a scam at this point.
I’ve never heard this claim. Googling it I see one thing that says 8, and that likely includes pre-production and all that stuff, before you move a full team into development. The Witcher 3 came out in 2015, so the team could not have moved to CP2077 before then, and some of them stayed to make the DLC and patches. That leaves 5 years of full time development, which is not odd for a modern AAA game.
I figured it was probably around 12 years, since the first teaser trailer came out 11 years ago, add afew years for the work they needed to do to even be ready to do a trailer (world lore, characters, etc)
It’s based off of a tabletop game. That trailer mostly just needed CGI work, and a basic feel for what they would aim for. That trailer was probably before pre-production even started.
Its worth mentioning that the 12 years was not at all productive. The first 6 years was basically just two guys with rough concepts, only 6 years of actual dev time. Then about 3 years in they got a new creative lead on the project who decided to scrap essentially everything and start from scratch on a whim. Then the devs get the release date the same time we do which is 2 years earlier than they expected having assumed that they’d get around 5 years of actual dev time since being made to start over.
So yeh there was a lot of screwing around by management.
they were coz cdproject red is still a company with multiple investors-buiness ppl but it still wasn’t an excuse the state game was in. it was really at a no excuse territory specially considering the scope amount of money that was spent on it . it wasn’t just outside pressure they did fuck up royally . but despite shit bugs (some very hilarious) at its core was a really good game and it showed even back then. so good on them ( despite the launch issues which are still inexcusable
Yeah, I think games just take longer to develop nowadays than anyone is prepared for, especially the managers. Both companies and gamers have yet to realize that there is only so much you can accomplish in a certain span of time.
I got this game finally last year, after waiting for the bugfixes, and have been playing since then. I’ve got over 170 hours now, did all the sidemissions and now finishing Phantom Liberty, and loved every minute of it. This was my first dive into the cyberpunk-genre and it is impressive, especially the dystopian future that also seeps through in modern times.
The way Cyberpunk 2077 tells its story and does world building is beautiful. The immense city with twirling roads, mountains of trash and dysfunctional society is really immersive. I understand that it is not possible to give every citizen a full back story with limited resources but the amount of detail and love that they were still able to put in is commendable. Even after all this time spent in the gameworld it still manages to surprise me with random encounters while exploring.
I’m glad I waited for the bugfixes and had only a few crashes and minor glitchy physics. I hope they learn that delivering a good product is more important then deadlines, since players like me will wait anyway.
Fun fact: in no other open-world-game I got run-over by cars as much as in this game. Hmm I wonder, maybe all cars evolved from Tesla’s in this universe? (j/k)
I just started it and am having a similar experience, right down to getting hit by cars. At least, I assume they were all cars. Last time I was suddenly knocked off my feet was on the sidewalk, and when I finally regained control of my character, there was no vehicle driving away from me. It could have been a goat fitted with optical camo for all I know.
Goat Simulator 2077
Haha those damn goats in octocamo… They should put beepers on 'em!
Man I’ve got really conflicted feelings about this game. I do think it’s great, and will probably be picking up Phantom Liberty next sale, but I never know whether to appreciate the devs for sticking with it and making sure their work lived up to expectations, or to be frustrated that I basically had to wait a year for a full product after buying for $80 CAD on day one (my own mistake, I foolishly thought CD Project was immune to such blunders). I guess it’s a bit of both. I do really appreciate all the hard work, I just wish that wasn’t on top of a bunch of frustration and disappointment.
Totally get where you’re coming from. But you can enjoy the game and dislike the way they marketed and released it. 90% of life isn’t a zero-sum game. Despite what the internet would have you believe.
This is true. However, even as a young person I remember the times where a game being released meant it was done, and if it was butchered, that was that. There was no second chance for the studio because the community absolutely wouldn’t trust them.
Now, that’s standard. Every AAA game is just assumed to basically be barely functional until 6+ months post launch. People have to say “why would you buy a game day one?” as if it’s a ridiculous notion to want to purchase a product that has been released onto a market. That sucks. It sucks that something that used to be a fun hobby is now a seedy grey market full of vitriole.
they should learn from the fiasco, don’t promise what the devs can’t deliver, marketing department should ask the devs what they can promote. and you shouldn’t buy game on day one 😂
The straight-up lies are what really get to me. Bullshots and fake-ass trailers for almost a decade. Hype for shit that was never going in. And now people just say “it’s great, what’s your problem?” like they want it to happen again.
I think when they fixed all the obvious jank, went all in on the world building and strong storytelling, and timed it with the incredibly excellent Cyberpunk Edge runners series… Everything turned around.
The game is still pretty crappy as a open-world, loot still feels halfbaked and honestly combat is so dumb that I have to gimp myself and refuse to pick certain skills just to have some challenge.
But I ignore it because when the story pulls you in, you’re hooked!
That’s funny, I feel kinda the opposite lol. The story just feels ok to me (I thought the story of PL was a lot more interesting though) but I just love the setting and just blasting through enemies
Last I played - forever ago - I was just disappointed that the random NPCs were nothing but decoration. Made the whole setting feel flat to me, sadly.
That aspect is definitely true. City of cardboard. But it was some pretty vibin cardboard
Oh absolutely, the best cardboard I’ve ever seen.
The NPCs constantly broke immersion for me. It’s the same 10 people over and over again.
Or if you’re fighting baddies or cops, they all act the same.
I loved the world, enjoyed its story but didn’t like the combat as it felt a bit messy and I felt overpowered as a hacker.
After two playthroughs, I’ll probably do the expansion at one point but I don’t know if I should play it from one of my playthrough or from a new save.
I bought this game day 1, put about 20 hours in and set it down.
Picked it up again three months ago and have not set it back down. Best game I have ever played. I’m a sucker for lore and mission content and this game just does not fail to deliver.
I know it had a rough launch and I don’t want that to be acceptable, but god damn this game is just so good. Like, so fucking good. Despite the launch I have to give it to them, they fixed it and it is just endlessly amazing
It’s outstanding, but even right now at its best it still isn’t perfect.
I’m very, very much looking forward to what they can eventually do using UE5 as the base in an era with generative AI to fill out the edges.
When the polish (pun intended) is there, the game is beyond everything else. But when you end up just a bit past the edges of where it holds your hand, it quickly loses the veneer, which is the key difference vs something like a Rockstar open world (but also very different budgets and aims).
There’s a handful of studios I think will adapt especially well to the future of game development, and CDPR is one of them.
Because it is going to be possible to have CP 2077 main scenario style interactions across an entire open world within the next decade. And who better to curate that experience than the people delivering it in a diagonal slice?
I played it a couple of years ago, before a lot of the patches, and still thought it was one of the better games I have never finished.
spoiler
There is this quest line where a character is abducted, raped, tortured and kills herself after you rescue her. Afterwards, the main character and another are on a balcony and smoke, still processing the horrors they’ve witnessed. I had been off the smokes for a few months at that point, but still needed to go outside and do the same.
I uninstalled shortly after. Not out of disgust, I actually appreciated the game making me feel something, but it just felt right to stop at that point.
The whole game has an amazing story, that actually hooks the player’s emotions. It’s fantastic. It’s so refreshing after so many games with lazy writing or voice acting. I also played shortly after release, only experiencing 2 major bugs in my playthrough. I know others had it worse, but it was actually refreshing on that front too.
Well deserved. It’s a masterpiece though it took a while to be polished properly
Legitimately one of my favorite games. Incredible story, characters, and side quests. It’s also the only time I’ve actually felt like I was in a city when playing a game, they absolutely nail the environment and setting. It feels like a true city, not a video game city.
Anyone play on the steam deck? How is the performance on it since the last update?
No issues with it. I am playing it exclusively on the steam deck.
Sweet. Thanks. SD has pretty much completely taken over as my gaming PC, so whenever I get around to 2077, I’ll be doing the same as you.
I keep hearing this from people but it runs terrible on my SD. Cannot get more than ~27 fps and it regularly dips below that.
Did you tweak the settings somehow?
I previously played it on my Xbox and had a great time. Would love to play it again on the SD eventually.
That’s weird did you tweak the graphics settings?
I am using the steam deck defaults and it is limited to 30 FPS. But it’s stable it didn’t bother me so far.
If I were to unlimit the FPS it stays in the 30-40 fps based on a small run I did now in Dogtown.
Second run female V. Discovered the game this year because I play it on Mac (using Whisky) and it wasn’t possible before.
I am not a gamer (as you can tell by my computer’s brand) as I really struggle to find games I want to invest time into. I’m too old to enjoy the thrill of dying 20 times in a row to kill a boss (been a WoW hard player for a few years, but mostly for the lore when it was still great) so I play easy mode and enjoy each and every bit of dialogue I can.
This game is one of the best Sci-Fi movie I’ve seen in years. Sometimes it makes me feel like I’m in 1982’s Blade Runner, waiting for Rutger Hauer to make an appearance. I already met Daryl Hannah and Sean Young (or very resembling characters at least).
Anyway, I don’t care much that the launch was terrible. I’m just glad the game exists.
PS: As a Metalhead myself, the only things I dislike about the game is Johnny’s band stuff. The game’s music is absolute dope though.
Tomb Mold does a few of the tracks on Ritual FM, I really liked that they got realworld artists to do in universe tracks. All of the stations are solid, love that they implemented radio outside of vehicles as well.
Ten years of Stockholm syndrome would cause that.
Reading this thread makes me feel like I’m taking crazy pills. This game was mediocre as fuck. The open world was practically empty. There were like five characters with anything but a superficial motivation. Combat is point and click nothingness, there is no strategy whatsoever and the AI is practically nonexistent. Constant bugs and graphical issues. The big fixes only fixes the very last thing.
Based on everyone telling me BotW and TotK are the finest games ever made, perhaps people just want mostly empty open worlds with basic combat and max five characters with personalities.
I felt the same about BotW. At first I enjoyed the freshness and exploration but it quickly gave way to the sinking realization that it’s an empty world with smatterings of lifeless villages and MMO-style quests. Ew.
Yeah. I’d much rather have the small number of deeper side quests in OoT or MM than, “hey buddy can you catch me ten crickets in exchange for a fistful of rupees? Thanks.”
Have you played it after the 2.0 update? The combat feels awesome, as least my build did. I also disagree with the openworld being empty, driving around, listening to music, was one of my favorite things to do. Occasionally coming across little stories and unmarked encampments was really fun.
So did you just mash through all the dialogue and cutscenes or
Amen to that. Technical issues aside, it’s one of the most shallow open world games I’ve played. There’s nothing to do when you’re not doing missions. There’s no depth to the combat. It’s a 5/10 at best for me.
i think you are being hyperbolic ( although its your subjetive opinion for sure ) id give it ez 7.5 etc… and higher coz i like cyberpunk you know i enjoyed shadowruns better ofc but thats coz i like izometrik
There is some truth to what you say but the game is more than a sum of its parts. Even though individual strokes of game dev brush may be not perfect the whole package as of today creates memorable, even unforgettable experience.
I think you’re one of the people who wanted a cyberpunk GTA game and didn’t get it.
The story is fucking amazing, some of the side quests will stay with you for a long time.
The combat and driving are fine, I endure both to get forward in the story.
Eh, at least as far as the combat goes I liked doing the Net Runner thing: hacking cameras left and right and killing off enemies before they ever saw me. That being said I put the game down when it became too much of a chore to get much anything upgraded. My combat style may have been suboptimal but I had fun with it.
I also didn’t have any issues with bugs or graphical issues, but I also first played it pretty far into its life after they could fix plenty of things. Don’t remember exactly when it was, but it was after the anime was no longer super relevant but before that big 2.0 update. I also know I played using some mods, and I can’t remember if there was a mod that fixed a bunch of issues.
CDPR has so many fanboys that they managed to convince other people that it was a good game.
I’m not a CDPR fanboy. Or at least I wasn’t before Cyberpunk. Cyberpunk and Hades are probably the best games I’ve played in a decade.
Man, I’m glad that people are enjoying the game as much as they say they are but I tried my first play through earlier this year and it was terrible. I saw almost no difference in the amount/type of glitches between what I experienced back in January and what I saw online when the game first released a few years ago.
I played on launch month and only encountered one bug that was game breaking and it was only a loading point glitch where I had to load to a previous save point. Played just a month ago and the whole game was super smooth.
One game breaking bug on a playthrough is still pretty bad.
At least three people have been successfully gaslit by game publishers.
I have 50+ hours and only minor graphic glitches. A couple dead bodies standing up, the odd piece of floating loot. Nothing that seriously detracts from the experience.
Played it two times on ps5. Once on 1.50 and once on 2.0. I haven’t experienced crazy glitches…
I’m ~3/4s through my second playthrough and appreciating it more and more. Haven’t picked up the expansion yet either.
I found it hits much harder with a female character. The Johnny Silverhand situation especially felt much more… metaphorically resonant? And Jackie feels more rogue-with-a-heart-of-gold when his best buddy is a woman.
Quickhacks are OP but felt correctly haxx0r, mantis blades are super fun. I enjoyed the combat well enough. Cars are meh, but it’s cyberpunk so if you’re not riding a futuristic bike ala Akira you’re doing it wrong. And wiping out on a bike is great.
The characterisation and world building are what really shine. I was reluctant to play the corpo background but it really makes the story sing.
spoiler
The first time you’re in a car with Judy she has a prominent tattoo that says “underwater where thoughts can breathe”. Then next mission or a while later her apartment has jellyfish looking paint splotches and an aquarium. It’s expanded on more explicitly later, but I really enjoy the way they pull together their characters.
The scene with Takemura on the roof talking about Bakeneko is another moment that I enjoyed first playthrough and came to really appreciate a lot the second time. His food snobbery becomes quite endearing after he accidentally texts you his attempts to search for restaurants.
It’s also my opinion the female voice actor did an incredible job where as the male voice actor did a great job. Even in the most basic of side quests, it feels like she is giving it her all to be V in that situation whereas on the other hand some lines it feels like he’s just phoning it in.
Admittedly I haven’t played the new expansion as male v yet, and that may change my opinion. Especially considering I think Keanu gave 110% percent on phantom liberty where I feel like there are certain lines in the original game that were just read from a sheet without context and marked as done
It’s also my opinion the female voice actor did an incredible job where as the male voice actor did a great job. Even in the most basic of side quests, it feels like she is giving it her all to be V in that situation whereas on the other hand some lines it feels like he’s just phoning it in.
100% agree. Male V just sounds like “generic video game man who is tough, but not too tough”, where as the female V sounds like a hardened, cold bitch that you don’t want to fuck with. Cherami Leigh’s got range.
Yeah like I said in my other comment, I’m having fun playing through a male v playthrough with the thinking that male v just doesn’t open up often, and is trying his best to keep his cards close. It’s a fun experiment, and plays homage to how male v’s voice actor plays the character, and how a hardened veteran nomad v or abused street kid v might interact with folks, but Cherami’s amazing work is canonical V to me.
Oh yeah, that’s a great point. I admit I stalled out of my male playthrough like 1/4 through, but for sure the voice acting felt lacking compared to female V, who really does a fantastic and job and sells every situation flawlessly. Now that you’ve mentioned it, it seems so obvious that that’s a huge part of the why female V is better.
I’m on a male playthrough a just recently started, and I think the trick is to realize that he’s playing the lines as a more aloof v, which is fine, and actually interesting psychologically as a v that “keeps his cards close to his chest and is cautious about who he opens up to” but you have to accept that version of v in your playthrough, whereas I got used to the “always emotionally invested v” of the female playthrough. Like I said, I still think he did a great job, but that mindset helps me to align the character with the experience. Either way, nice convo, choom
That reading of the character makes sense and jives with how I connect with games I play. I’ll keep it in mind when I go back for a male playthrough - gonna have to romance panam eventually. Agreed choom!
