So having 100€ savings in a year for a 200€ panel is a bad deal for you? Seriously 200€ is cheap enough for nearly all German households to afford them. What you are essentially doing is give most German households the ability to produce their own power, greatly enhancing fair power distribution, lower the electricity bill for them and give valuable capital most of the population. The only draw back is that they produce 30-50% less electricity, but forcing that would mean that you support big corporations building those solar panels, which only helps the rich.
Are you claiming that solar panels have a positive co2 footprint? This policy change was a massive step to a) boost solar power and b) boost decentralized energy security. Calling this “consumerism” is absolutely moronic.
Are you claiming that solar panels have a positive co2 footprint?
Wait, are you claiming they don’t? (assuming you mean a positive CO₂ footprint means net emission of CO₂).
Solar panels absolutely don’t reduce CO₂. They make things worse more slowly, just as electric cars do, but they’re still making things worse. They are most certainly not carbon neutral, let alone permanently capturing CO₂. They’re an energy multiplier, which is less bad than using the energy without the multiplier, but it isn’t a net positive.
Which I think is probably the crux of OPs point.
Edit: WTF, where are OP’s messages? They weren’t abusive from my memory, they were quite the opposite of climate-crisis-denying. They were perhaps hyperbolic and absolutist, but I from my memory of them there was no reason to remove them.
Solar panels do not have a positive CO2 footprint in the sense that they are net emitters of CO2. While the production of solar panels generates CO2 emissions, studies have shown that the overall carbon footprint of solar panels is significantly lower than that of traditional fossil fuel-based energy sources.
A life-cycle assessment of solar panels found that the carbon footprint of solar panels is approximately 20-50 grams of CO2-equivalent per kilowatt-hour (kWh) of electricity generated . In contrast, the carbon footprint of coal-fired power plants is around 1,000 grams of CO2-equivalent per kWh .
Research suggests that solar panels can offset their life-cycle emissions within 2-4 years of operation, and can generate clean energy for decades beyond that . A study published in the journal Environmental Science & Technology found that the net carbon emissions savings from solar panels can be up to 78% compared to traditional fossil fuel-based energy sources.
hardly slighty less shit id say.
References:
Fthenakis, V. M., & Kim, H. C. (2011). Life-cycle greenhouse gas emissions of solar panels. Renewable and Sustainable Energy Reviews, 15(8), 3521-3533.
IPCC (2013). Climate Change 2013: The Physical Science Basis. Contribution of Working Group I to the Fifth Assessment Report of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.
Reich, N. H., & Alsema, E. A. (2017). Environmental impacts of solar energy systems. In Solar Energy Engineering (pp. 255-274). Academic Press.
Perez, M. J. R., Fthenakis, V. M., & Kim, H. C. (2019). Life-cycle greenhouse gas emissions and net energy analysis of solar panels. Environmental Science & Technology, 53(11), 6453-6462.
Wait, are you claiming they don’t? (assuming you mean a positive CO₂ footprint means net emission of CO₂).
Well, yes. As opposed to a negative footprint, for things that maybe not directly reduce co2 by indirectly, such as renewable energies - solar panels being one of them.
Solar panels absolutely don’t reduce CO₂. They make things worse more slowly, just as electric cars do, but they’re still making things worse. They are most certainly not carbon neutral, let alone permanently capturing CO₂. They’re an energy multiplier, which is less bad than using the energy without the multiplier, but it isn’t a net positive.
Which I think is probably the crux of OPs point.
Hence my cave & stone tablet comment. OP surely does not own a carbon neutral computer and uses a carbon neutral internet. But yes, technically speaking solar panels are carbon neutral, since they can generate more power than they consume. Obviously this very much depends on what this energy is ultimately used for but that’s just pedantic.
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local energy independence is a massive W regardless of where the panels came from or if they were subsidized
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So having 100€ savings in a year for a 200€ panel is a bad deal for you? Seriously 200€ is cheap enough for nearly all German households to afford them. What you are essentially doing is give most German households the ability to produce their own power, greatly enhancing fair power distribution, lower the electricity bill for them and give valuable capital most of the population. The only draw back is that they produce 30-50% less electricity, but forcing that would mean that you support big corporations building those solar panels, which only helps the rich.
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Are you claiming that solar panels have a positive co2 footprint? This policy change was a massive step to a) boost solar power and b) boost decentralized energy security. Calling this “consumerism” is absolutely moronic.
Wait, are you claiming they don’t? (assuming you mean a positive CO₂ footprint means net emission of CO₂).
Solar panels absolutely don’t reduce CO₂. They make things worse more slowly, just as electric cars do, but they’re still making things worse. They are most certainly not carbon neutral, let alone permanently capturing CO₂. They’re an energy multiplier, which is less bad than using the energy without the multiplier, but it isn’t a net positive.
Which I think is probably the crux of OPs point.
Edit: WTF, where are OP’s messages? They weren’t abusive from my memory, they were quite the opposite of climate-crisis-denying. They were perhaps hyperbolic and absolutist, but I from my memory of them there was no reason to remove them.
Solar panels do not have a positive CO2 footprint in the sense that they are net emitters of CO2. While the production of solar panels generates CO2 emissions, studies have shown that the overall carbon footprint of solar panels is significantly lower than that of traditional fossil fuel-based energy sources.
A life-cycle assessment of solar panels found that the carbon footprint of solar panels is approximately 20-50 grams of CO2-equivalent per kilowatt-hour (kWh) of electricity generated . In contrast, the carbon footprint of coal-fired power plants is around 1,000 grams of CO2-equivalent per kWh .
Research suggests that solar panels can offset their life-cycle emissions within 2-4 years of operation, and can generate clean energy for decades beyond that . A study published in the journal Environmental Science & Technology found that the net carbon emissions savings from solar panels can be up to 78% compared to traditional fossil fuel-based energy sources.
hardly slighty less shit id say.
References:
Fthenakis, V. M., & Kim, H. C. (2011). Life-cycle greenhouse gas emissions of solar panels. Renewable and Sustainable Energy Reviews, 15(8), 3521-3533.
IPCC (2013). Climate Change 2013: The Physical Science Basis. Contribution of Working Group I to the Fifth Assessment Report of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.
Reich, N. H., & Alsema, E. A. (2017). Environmental impacts of solar energy systems. In Solar Energy Engineering (pp. 255-274). Academic Press.
Perez, M. J. R., Fthenakis, V. M., & Kim, H. C. (2019). Life-cycle greenhouse gas emissions and net energy analysis of solar panels. Environmental Science & Technology, 53(11), 6453-6462.
Well, yes. As opposed to a negative footprint, for things that maybe not directly reduce co2 by indirectly, such as renewable energies - solar panels being one of them.
Hence my cave & stone tablet comment. OP surely does not own a carbon neutral computer and uses a carbon neutral internet. But yes, technically speaking solar panels are carbon neutral, since they can generate more power than they consume. Obviously this very much depends on what this energy is ultimately used for but that’s just pedantic.
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I guess we can find a bit of wisdom even in you. What’s that stone tablet you’re writing on from within your cave anyway?