Reddit removes years of chat and message archives from users’ accounts::undefined
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My gut tells me they are not deleted but rather simply no longer publicly available. Can’t have these pesky AI bots training for free.
I think it’s the opposite. These are private chats that can’t be sold to the AI, that’s why Reddit thinks they’re worthless.
More likely just moved to cold storage to save money. It’s expensive to keep data in an easily accessible database. If you don’t need to access it you can move it to object storage for pennies on the dollar and still keep it accessible for whatever nefarious data brokers you want to sell it to in the future
They’re implementing new chat infrastructure and only replicated 2023/01/01 forward. It’s in the article.
Oh man.
To be able to have a long running project and decide to truncate years worth of data…
Just, drop it like you never need it again.Apart from working at Reddit, sounds like a dream
This. My static websites are on GCP with Cloudflare https. Storage costs are almost literally zero. I pay when people access/read. My storage cost is never over 8 bucks/month. Unused, 10 cents a year.
How much data are you storing and how much do you think reddit is?
Oh no comparison! Mines like 10 to 50 gb. I assume reddit’s is in high terabytes.
The point is cloud services charge for data leaving storage over networks.
Just guessing, and I’m not gonna RTFM and do the math, but for “cold line” storage a static petabyte would be maybe hundreds of dollars/mo max. That’s noise to them.
Right but the difference is Reddit is now charging an extortionate amount for data access via the API when compared to other platforms.
What do you think this (if achieved what was hoped) massive new flow of income was supposed to help sustain?
Oh yeah, infrastructure costs.GROWTH. The upcoming IPO is for a publicly traded growth corporation. Read about how they work. The side 2ffects are appalling.
It is nothing like you’d imagine a corner store working, where profit is the goal.
Read about how they work.
No need to be quite so condescending is there?
I fully understand how they work.
Seems like this growth they should be trying to achieve is fucking futile when they:- cut off the apps that a portion of their most active users use
- prevent helpful bots (automod etc.) working correctly or being financially viable due to API changes
- shuttered an award system that helped maintain engagement via vain dopamine acquisition and actively made them money with no replacement in sight other than some data mined financial incentive program which will lead to a lack of genuine discussion
- spat in the face of their largely volunteer moderation community who volunteer their time for free to help keep things smooth
- delete the content histories of their users when it isn’t publicly facing. Users give content to platform, that’s how Reddit exists, to remove DMs from users it makes it very apparent they’re content pigs and nothing more. Can’t have a transactional platform (content to profit) if the content doesn’t feel any incentive to use the platform.
Not to mention, infrastructure costs lead to growth.
If you don’t have the resources to support your current platform, you shouldn’t be actively trying to grow the platform by discarding older content. It makes those accessing and making use of the content (be it individual or institutional) lose trust in the quality of data.Great growth strategy that.
My apologies! I was commenting only on the cost of cold line storage, for the hypothesis reddit is offline storing data, only. I meant, there, to know the cost look for the pricing page it’s reasonably readable.
Tbh I find the order of Lemmy reply presentation a bit confusing sometimes.
He means the business model they’re going for with the IPO.
Growth means the value of the company. The shares. The stockholders getting dividends. It has fuck all to with user experience, or even user growth. It’s about manipulating information and using clever accounting to get investors to give you money.
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They’re implementing new chat infrastructure and only replicated 2023/01/01 forward. It’s in the article.
Probably want to prevent people from deleting their own messages. Can’t delete messages you don’t have access to anymore.
100%. The idea that reddit would just permanently delete all those chat messages rather than just archive them away from the public is crazy. Even if they don’t directly sell them to advertisers there’s a shitload of value for private ML training
Can’t have those pesky users deleting spez’s retirement fund
100%. The idea that reddit would just permanently delete all those chat messages rather than just archive them away from the public is crazy. Even if they don’t directly sell them to advertisers there’s a shitload of value for private ML training
Training on inaccessible private chat logs?
Many of those left on reddit, not all but many, are the ones who were happily shitting on the mods who were protesting. Fuck those trolls, they voted for the Leopard Party. The rest of us did a data request like it said when the shenanigans started because the writing was on the wall.
Lol, exactly. Sucks to be anyone still licking Redditinc boot. I have my datadump, I used chat maybe once, twice then turned it off.
I’m blown away by how it seems Reddit makes the wrong decision all the time.
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It’ll blow over sooner if we do it while they’re still mad instead of making them mad again.
Bad move. Should have waited until people had cooled down from being mad. Now they’re mad for more than one reason, which makes them more likely to leave.
That conspiracy theory that Twitter and Reddit are being killed deliberately in order to stifle the public’s ability to organize mass movements during the lead up to the 2024 election is looking plausiblier and plausiblier. (It’s a perfectly cromulent word, shut up!)
Ribbit
When you’re the CEO of a platform you don’t care about anymore and just want to cash out, wrong decisions are a dime a dozen.
Mashable confirmed with Reddit that messages and chat history are no longer available if they were made prior to January 1, 2023.
Retain only half a year worth of content? What the fuck? That’s absurd.
In our continued pursuit of empowering communities, we are transitioning to a new chat infrastructure, shared in our previous updates here and here. In an effort to have a smooth and quick transition to this new infrastructure, …
If you can migrate 6 months’ worth of data, how is older data any different? The data is there, in the same form. The timespan should not matter at all. It’s either the same form, or interfaced to transparently integrate into the existing system - which would allow migration all the same.
A Reddit spokesperson forwarded Mashable a changelog announcement(opens in a new tab) made on June 22 where the company shared that these messages would be removed.
Absolutely absurd.
announcing removal of 18 years of content, of central functionality, announced just 20 days ago, in an obscure place, and after random uninteresting flair navigation and chat channel announcements spanning multiple paragraphs and screenshots.
Baffling.
Acting as if they were managing a personal project that only they themselves use.
They will sell access to that 18 years of content. They don’t want it able to be scraped in any way.
To prevent scraping, users who don’t pay can only read 20 of their own comments per day.
There it is.
In our continued pursuit of empowering communities, we are transitioning to a new chat infrastructure, shared in our previous updates here and here. In an effort to have a smooth and quick transition to this new infrastructure
Just standard verbose bullshit PR talk
Lane closed to ease conjestion
Posting notices like the Vogons.
This made me snort
Your drug habits are none of my business.
Text is basically free to host, especially text that you can index on a primary key like an account id. The only reason to do this is to reduce dev maintenance costs, but they’re not achieving that by cutting back on the storage time
But they were restoring all my posts and comments for weeks after I deleted them.
Same, though I guess maybe? The public posts and comments make reddit more valuable. Private messages don’t.
That being said, I’m calling incompetence on this one.
Ribbit
In an effort to have a smooth and quick transition to this new infrastructure, we will migrate chat messages sent from January 1, 2023 onward. This change will be effective starting June 30th.
It really seems like everything reddit is doing is rushed and always chooses to harm the users as a default. It’s as if they’re actively sabotaging their own platform.
They don’t want users to be able to wipe their own chats manually or via GDPR requests.
If anyone asks, they will be told that the data is gone, but we all know that’s not the case. They do have backups.
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Every decision they’ve made in the recent past, they have went with the worst possibly option available. Repeatedly.
Remember when people were critical of Lemmy because an instance admin could shut down and you’d lose all your account history…
There’s also a guy who says that Lemmy was created by a communist.
Well, this time “at least it’s not spez” works even if it’s a fallacy.
Weren’t they a tankie? I’ve heard about it a couple of times on Reddit before joining the fediverse but I don’t have proofs myself.
They are yes. They’re also admins of the oldest lemmy instances, lemmygrad.ml and lemmy.ml (ml stands for “Marxist-Leninist”).
The important point is Lemmy is not beholden to them. By design.
If they fuck with something down the line, it can be forked.
Like how Emby’s attempts to kill itself for profit birthed a fork that came to be known as Jellyfin, which now overshadows it.
Agreed… I’ve come to the conclusion that it doesn’t matter so I don’t give a shit, though.
Yep, they may be tankies but they have pretty decent values besides that, and if they ever do anything really bad with it there will be many people ready and willing to fork it.
Finally, somebody says the obvious.
ML stands for Machine Learning and just became a popular domain for open source apps.
Yeah, but that’s not why lemmygrad chose to use ml lol
But we were talking about lemmy.ml too
Yeah same thing, they were created by the same people
As I understand it: Yes, but they allowed Lemmy to outgrow them.
That’s the most important part.
They do better than Soviet union, lol.
Absolutely true even now. But Lemmy has good APIs which can be used to download all data. But the core idea is if you really want to have complete control over your data, just roll-out your own instance. Save the data for as long as you like.
Sure, it could happen. But it’s not an argument in Reddit’s favor when they’re apparently just as willing to clear out your history too.
whelp, the real “landed gentry” have spoken. now back to the fields, serf!
And here they were saying the private subreddits were causing usability issues…
The admins, not to be out done, have now just broken search links and user experience for the whole rest of the site. Not just for the private subreddits.
I can take my browsing somewhere else, but the biggest casualty of reddit’s implosion for me will be the years of help posts in hardware and Linux focused subs.
I mod a linux sub over there. Any tips on what to do?
Make Lemmy alternative and migrate here! Sorry that’s not really a tip, but still it’s a good idea!
https://redact.dev Edit all your posts and comments with a link to your new home here.
Of reddit comments and posts those were the ones that hurt most to delete. The tech support/tutorial stuff. It hurts me a bit to think that in the future someone might search for a particular error message spat out by an installation script or how to achieve a partícular effect in a image editor and turn up empty handed. Power delete suite let me export all my content but besides the effort to repost it’s just not the same because I have only a single piece of the puzzle. What makes sites like Reddit so powerful is the branching back and forth between multiple roles. So you might have a post about a partícular error message and 4-5 different suggestions on how to deal with it each with feedback on how well the solution worked, what you need to watch out for and how to avoid the problem in the future.
Oh that’s fine. Fuck the Reddit chat function. Only scammers and spammers ever messaged me on that shit.
Dont forget about the trolls lol
The self help bot is worse. It was only used to push vulnerable people over the edge and for pissing off people who couldn’t pm someone who disagrees with them.
I always enjoyed reporting the abuse of the self help function and just smiled that I aggravated a low-life that much. It’s laughably pathetic.
The help bot has instructions on how to report abuse that didn’t even work.
Why would they work? The only function of reddit cares was harassment.
He really saw Elon destroy Twitter and decided to try a speedrun.
Only chat history I had there was spammers trying to sell me crypto.
I had conversations with my ex on there so on the one hand, it is good I can’t return any more to torture myself with reminders of what a piece of shit I am, but on the other hand my psyche irrationally feels despair because it cannot return to torture myself with reminders of what a piece of shit I am
You lost a remnant of someone you cared about, so it makes sense even though it was bad for you in the long run
Would it help you if I called you a piece of shit from time to time?
Thanks for the offer, but for the proper effect you’d have to fall in love with me for a few years, then break up with me, with me getting weirdly clingy and longing in the following “trying to be friends” phase, with me slowly realizing what a bad influence I had been in your life and crashing into the realization that it was pure hubris of me to think I could be deserving of love and in a healthy relationship to begin with. That sort of messed-upness doesn’t come that easy.
Or trading advice 😂
Mine probably was, too. I only used old.reddit, so I didn’t even see that there was a chat.
Reddit is sinking.Hopefully the captain goes down with the ship.
The only thing he’s going down on right now is Elon’s ego.
Good thing I’ve brought a towel
Now there’s a hoopy frood!
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This is such weird self-destructive behavior by Reddit.
One oddity: I requested a complete archive on June 21 and received it on July 6, and for some reason it includes my incoming private messages going back only to Oct 2021.
I expected it to be either complete (~2015) or chopped off at 1/1/2023 like chat. Why Oct 2021???
I even seen messages there that I hadn’t received in Reddit. There was someone selling weed.
Man fuck those fascists. I am glad for every day that I am not on there writing content for them. Now granted my content might be shyte but it still drove revenue. 😆
I’m doing a full history delete using my data request as a reference to all my comments. 17761 comments. Many stupid crap, but also many helpful tech related stuff that will no longer drive traffic to Reddit.
using my data request as a reference to all my comments
You… absolute genius. Thank you, that should have occurred to me. 🤦 This I can just script to catch all the old ones that don’t show up in the user overview.
Their rate limiting is a bit annoying, but after adding a 3 second delay (maybe overkill) the deletions seem to be progressing steadily.
That’s just so sad to me. Is there any place we could tell people to store or upload these things? I hate that we’re losing so much because of one company’s hubris.
Honestly even an instance that’s just “deletedposts.lemmy” or something like that, to save posts that were useful.
Agree that it’s sad, and I’ve got the export of my posts if that ends up being useful… but idk what to do with it rn
Sooner or later someone will make something, either a site or actual software, that will be able to parse the dumps and present it in a user-friendly fashion. There are enough users out there with data dumps now to justify it.
If/when it happens it’ll also be possible to create an archive everyone can see and search that isn’t beholden to reddit at all.
Fascists, is it?
