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Do you mean the negative reaction to the post as astroturfing or the content of the essay? If the former then indeed I can agree, I don’t understand the negative reaction to this post given what is actual content of the essay - that it’s easy to fall into a trap of spending too much time on electoral politics instead of organizing in the real world and that in first past the post voting systems only elections where possible results of elections are not certain (it’s hard to predict the winner) actually matter, which is a thesis with some merit I would say.
Alright, so… I did originally mean your post, but I had not properly watched the video (skimmed cause didn’t have 30 mins). So now that I’ve seen more, I’d like to correct myself.
First of all, I agree with your take on political organizing outside of mainstream elections. I think this is the best (perhaps only) tool of truly improving our democracies and lives. I actually think some level of organization and self-education is my democratic duty.
And yes, I also think the regular buzz around elections is a thinly veiled disguise for a distraction from relevant politics. However, only because my vote won’t fix much, doesn’t mean it can’t make things worse.
Voting may not work to improve a democracy, but it sure works to damage it. Depending on how deteriorated your voting system is (bad representation, easily gerrymandered,…) an election may only be a choice between bad and worse.
So I vote for the least bad option and use the opportunity as a painful reminder of how messed up my democracy already is. And then I do actual politics outside of the booth to try and fix it.
The reason I alleged astroturfing is because there are antidemocratic interest groups, very intent on getting leftists to not vote. Your title (I know, it’s just the video title) doesn’t make a clear distinction between “voting isn’t enough” and “voting is useless/don’t do it”.
I think we might agree on a great many things and just had a bad start (next time I’ll watch the vid first, but in my defense your title is misleading too). I’d rather work together with a fellow leftists towards improvement, then be needlessly divided.
It seems like we indeed agree here. Assumption of bad intentions happens, maybe indeed a bit too much in leftist circles given our goals unfortunately but I understand.
Do you mean the negative reaction to the post as astroturfing or the content of the essay? If the former then indeed I can agree, I don’t understand the negative reaction to this post given what is actual content of the essay - that it’s easy to fall into a trap of spending too much time on electoral politics instead of organizing in the real world and that in first past the post voting systems only elections where possible results of elections are not certain (it’s hard to predict the winner) actually matter, which is a thesis with some merit I would say.
Alright, so… I did originally mean your post, but I had not properly watched the video (skimmed cause didn’t have 30 mins). So now that I’ve seen more, I’d like to correct myself.
First of all, I agree with your take on political organizing outside of mainstream elections. I think this is the best (perhaps only) tool of truly improving our democracies and lives. I actually think some level of organization and self-education is my democratic duty.
And yes, I also think the regular buzz around elections is a thinly veiled disguise for a distraction from relevant politics. However, only because my vote won’t fix much, doesn’t mean it can’t make things worse.
Voting may not work to improve a democracy, but it sure works to damage it. Depending on how deteriorated your voting system is (bad representation, easily gerrymandered,…) an election may only be a choice between bad and worse. So I vote for the least bad option and use the opportunity as a painful reminder of how messed up my democracy already is. And then I do actual politics outside of the booth to try and fix it.
The reason I alleged astroturfing is because there are antidemocratic interest groups, very intent on getting leftists to not vote. Your title (I know, it’s just the video title) doesn’t make a clear distinction between “voting isn’t enough” and “voting is useless/don’t do it”.
I think we might agree on a great many things and just had a bad start (next time I’ll watch the vid first, but in my defense your title is misleading too). I’d rather work together with a fellow leftists towards improvement, then be needlessly divided.
It seems like we indeed agree here. Assumption of bad intentions happens, maybe indeed a bit too much in leftist circles given our goals unfortunately but I understand.