I use FF as my primary browser on my desktop, laptop, and mobile devices.
As much as I love and support FF and the Mozilla Foundation, I find that some websites simply need a Chromium-based browser to function properly. It’s frustrating as hell.
I wonder how many people tried FF, had their favourite site stop working, and then switched back to Chrome.
If you properly use firefox personalised the way you want it, it gives you shitty unusable websites in Europe too. Banking says no, newspapers being buggy to unreadable with certain script blocking or cookie refusal, disable adblock to continue windows etc, it all exists here too. I always try ff. If really needed I open the shitty site in edge and afterwards return to ff… Also public (tax payer funded!) flemish radio and tv for example is completely unusable in ff with proper settings, works “perfect” in edge or chrome. German and Dutch public TV and radio works fine in ff tho.
I’ve been a long time FF user, and if I encounter a buggy site I just wouldn’t use it. Only problematic site is fucking Teams, and since I can’t just stop using it, I’ll switch to brave for the meeting and right back to FF after.
Unfortunately chromebooks have been one of the cheapest options for a whole now and have been being introduced all over school systems in the US so kids are used to them and uninformed parents will continue to buy what they know meete school requirements.
Everyone that can definitely should switch to Firefox.
Never said they were. But it’s foolish to ignore the significant populations of school children and older non technical people who have been reccomended the cheapest thing that won’t get viruses and let’s them get on Facebook and YouTube.
You can fork it and basically freeze it at manifest-v2.
The problem is, all the big tech sumbitches, their buddies and all the companies who want a corporate website that Just Works [tm] will support Google’s new shit, and your privacy-respecting fork will slowly deprecate and stop working right, because you don’t have the resources to mirror new features in Google’s official browser. And of course, ordinary internet users with stick to Google’s version because they need a browser that works.
Chicken and egg… In fact, that’s exactly what’s happening to Firefox and why it’s sliding into irrelevance: Google is simply too massive and too monopolistic to resist for very long. Mozilla has had hundreds of millions to throw at trying and even they are on the verge of losing the battle completely.
Look, I’m a Linux user, and I prefer to use Free apps. However, the truth must be told: Firefox is not as optimized as Chrome. On older devices, Chrome is twice as fast in youtube playback, and it uses way less RAM overall. Chrome is the better browser in terms of architecture, at least for older PCs (and I have a whole bunch of them). On my main PC, running Debian-Testing, which is a newer PC, I do use Firefox, because it can handle stuff ok with enough CPU power. But for all my older PCs (anywhere from 5 to 15 years old), I have to use Chrome.
Now, if you find me a de-googled, Free, WELL-MAINTANED Chromium browser, I rather use that than Chrome. No, Brave, etc don’t cut it. I want a community-driven, well maintained Chromium browser. Currently, all de-googled versions are not well maintained, or not available as native packages on Debian.
EDIT: So, downvoted, huh? By fellow open source users who don’t want to hear the truth?
Google has a history of sabotaging Firefox in YouTube, because they can. This is a YouTube problem more than a Firefox problem. I know that’s not really helpful for you as an end user, but I want to mention it because really, Google deserves the blame.
I can’t downvote you from my instance, but you do realise it’s been pretty well-known, for at least a decade in certain circles, that YouTube specifically slows down on Firefox? I’m pretty sure you can test this yourself by changing user agents. So that hardly seems like a fair test of a browser’s speed.
So, downvoted, huh? By fellow open source users who don’t want to hear the truth?
The truth is that you might have experienced this, but this might not reflect the average user’s experience. My older ThinkPad feels no difference in better life based on the web browser.
the truth must be told: Firefox is not as optimized as Chrome
what are you talking about? my desktop pc is amd fx4300. definition of old and subpar - https://i.imgur.com/WBm5Ub1.png - and i have 313 open tabs right now.
granted, that is slightly more affected by memory, before i updated from 8 to 32 gb recently, it was admittedly slightly more sluggish.
but at the same time normal people don’t really have 300 open tabs at once and also you have to ask what is the threshold where you are willing to sacrifice your privacy for slight speed increase.
do you have some numbers to support that speed difference, or is it just your feeling, or anecdote that is being passed around and everyone repeats it and everyone believes it, because everyone says so?
A proprietary browser is a non-starter for me, especially when there are many free alternatives, even Chromium based ones. I’d take Ungoogled-Chromium on desktop or Cromite on mobile, heck I’d take Brave even.
Yes, Vivaldi isn’t fullFOSS, because 5% of the script of the unique UI is proprietary of Vivaldi, but it’s 100% auditable and even moddeable by the user, they even show how to do it in its community. Edge and Chrome would fork it in the same moment when Vivaldi make it OpenSource, killing all other Chromium and Vivaldi itself. Maybe in the future it will go full OpenSource, there are still intern debates about it.
The sense of OpenSource is to be capable to collaborate in new products, but with almost 100 browsers and forks in the market, this value is pretty debatable. For the user is more important the ethics of the company respect the user, in this case a european, employee-owned cooperative, which is given with a full transparency in all it’s services included in the account (mail, calendar, feed, blog, the Vivaldi Mastodon instance, e2ee sync in own server, etc.).
I will continue to maintain that it is bitterly ironic for a product which is 95% based on free software to be so hostile to software freedom. They feel so entitled to take but don’t want to give back, and they justify it by saying that that others will do the same thing they did if they do make it fully free.
Does Vivaldi play nice with Wayland? I have it installed (can’t remember if was an rpm or flatpak) but seems to crash kinda often. Sometimes to the point of gnome session restarting. I used to have the opposite problem with my previous PC. All AMD cpu/GPU. Stock fedora 40 gnome.
It’s a company that wants google’s spot in the ad business with a different approach, in the long run we’ll have the same shit as Google if they succeed.
what i don’t get is all the people complaining about google and at the same time using their browser…
i believe that trying to steer masses away from chrome would be more useful in the long run than trying to make it work
Just use Firefox
Seriously… enough of this “oh well its not that bad, atleast we can still do this, or that. Maybe blockers will work but with less features, etc.”
Fuck that shit
Always has been.
Tired of getting fucked by chr0me and g00gle? Stop spreading your cheeks and just use Firefox (librewolf, mull, et. al.) and uBlock Origin.
Simple as.
Until Mozilla caves & Fx fully adopts Manifest v3. I hope it doesn’t happen but would not surprise me in the slightest if they did
I use FF as my primary browser on my desktop, laptop, and mobile devices.
As much as I love and support FF and the Mozilla Foundation, I find that some websites simply need a Chromium-based browser to function properly. It’s frustrating as hell.
I wonder how many people tried FF, had their favourite site stop working, and then switched back to Chrome.
Until now I never had issues with Firefox.
But here in Germany the fanbase of ff ist larger. Maybe that’s why you don’t have problems with most of sites from Europe?!?
That’s an interesting observation. I’m not sure, since I’m in Canada.
If you properly use firefox personalised the way you want it, it gives you shitty unusable websites in Europe too. Banking says no, newspapers being buggy to unreadable with certain script blocking or cookie refusal, disable adblock to continue windows etc, it all exists here too. I always try ff. If really needed I open the shitty site in edge and afterwards return to ff… Also public (tax payer funded!) flemish radio and tv for example is completely unusable in ff with proper settings, works “perfect” in edge or chrome. German and Dutch public TV and radio works fine in ff tho.
deleted by creator
hmm, you’re gonna hate it but the reason is “because edge is already there” pre-installed
I’ve been a long time FF user, and if I encounter a buggy site I just wouldn’t use it. Only problematic site is fucking Teams, and since I can’t just stop using it, I’ll switch to brave for the meeting and right back to FF after.
people are somehow allergic to firefox
yeah, but Firefox ships w/ Yahoo as the default search engine 😱
No it doesn’t? It uses Google.
Hmm, well, it used to, but I guess it’s been that long since I’ve fresh installed Firefox. Today I learned.
Unfortunately chromebooks have been one of the cheapest options for a whole now and have been being introduced all over school systems in the US so kids are used to them and uninformed parents will continue to buy what they know meete school requirements.
Everyone that can definitely should switch to Firefox.
Most people are not accessing the internet via a Chromebook.
Never said they were. But it’s foolish to ignore the significant populations of school children and older non technical people who have been reccomended the cheapest thing that won’t get viruses and let’s them get on Facebook and YouTube.
We had B2G (Boot to Gecko) for a while. We could have had FxOS on laptops instead of one shitty midrange phone & maybe it would have worked. 😔
You can fork it and basically freeze it at manifest-v2.
The problem is, all the big tech sumbitches, their buddies and all the companies who want a corporate website that Just Works [tm] will support Google’s new shit, and your privacy-respecting fork will slowly deprecate and stop working right, because you don’t have the resources to mirror new features in Google’s official browser. And of course, ordinary internet users with stick to Google’s version because they need a browser that works.
Chicken and egg… In fact, that’s exactly what’s happening to Firefox and why it’s sliding into irrelevance: Google is simply too massive and too monopolistic to resist for very long. Mozilla has had hundreds of millions to throw at trying and even they are on the verge of losing the battle completely.
Look, I’m a Linux user, and I prefer to use Free apps. However, the truth must be told: Firefox is not as optimized as Chrome. On older devices, Chrome is twice as fast in youtube playback, and it uses way less RAM overall. Chrome is the better browser in terms of architecture, at least for older PCs (and I have a whole bunch of them). On my main PC, running Debian-Testing, which is a newer PC, I do use Firefox, because it can handle stuff ok with enough CPU power. But for all my older PCs (anywhere from 5 to 15 years old), I have to use Chrome.
Now, if you find me a de-googled, Free, WELL-MAINTANED Chromium browser, I rather use that than Chrome. No, Brave, etc don’t cut it. I want a community-driven, well maintained Chromium browser. Currently, all de-googled versions are not well maintained, or not available as native packages on Debian.
EDIT: So, downvoted, huh? By fellow open source users who don’t want to hear the truth?
Google has a history of sabotaging Firefox in YouTube, because they can. This is a YouTube problem more than a Firefox problem. I know that’s not really helpful for you as an end user, but I want to mention it because really, Google deserves the blame.
I can’t downvote you from my instance, but you do realise it’s been pretty well-known, for at least a decade in certain circles, that YouTube specifically slows down on Firefox? I’m pretty sure you can test this yourself by changing user agents. So that hardly seems like a fair test of a browser’s speed.
The truth is that you might have experienced this, but this might not reflect the average user’s experience. My older ThinkPad feels no difference in better life based on the web browser.
what are you talking about? my desktop pc is amd fx4300. definition of old and subpar - https://i.imgur.com/WBm5Ub1.png - and i have 313 open tabs right now.
granted, that is slightly more affected by memory, before i updated from 8 to 32 gb recently, it was admittedly slightly more sluggish.
but at the same time normal people don’t really have 300 open tabs at once and also you have to ask what is the threshold where you are willing to sacrifice your privacy for slight speed increase.
do you have some numbers to support that speed difference, or is it just your feeling, or anecdote that is being passed around and everyone repeats it and everyone believes it, because everyone says so?
Vivaldi, good maintaned, no calls to Google, inbuild and customizable ad and trackerblocker. If Chromium, than this one.
A proprietary browser is a non-starter for me, especially when there are many free alternatives, even Chromium based ones. I’d take Ungoogled-Chromium on desktop or Cromite on mobile, heck I’d take Brave even.
Yes, Vivaldi isn’t fullFOSS, because 5% of the script of the unique UI is proprietary of Vivaldi, but it’s 100% auditable and even moddeable by the user, they even show how to do it in its community. Edge and Chrome would fork it in the same moment when Vivaldi make it OpenSource, killing all other Chromium and Vivaldi itself. Maybe in the future it will go full OpenSource, there are still intern debates about it. The sense of OpenSource is to be capable to collaborate in new products, but with almost 100 browsers and forks in the market, this value is pretty debatable. For the user is more important the ethics of the company respect the user, in this case a european, employee-owned cooperative, which is given with a full transparency in all it’s services included in the account (mail, calendar, feed, blog, the Vivaldi Mastodon instance, e2ee sync in own server, etc.).
I will continue to maintain that it is bitterly ironic for a product which is 95% based on free software to be so hostile to software freedom. They feel so entitled to take but don’t want to give back, and they justify it by saying that that others will do the same thing they did if they do make it fully free.
Does Vivaldi play nice with Wayland? I have it installed (can’t remember if was an rpm or flatpak) but seems to crash kinda often. Sometimes to the point of gnome session restarting. I used to have the opposite problem with my previous PC. All AMD cpu/GPU. Stock fedora 40 gnome.
Why doesnt brave cut it? Also ungoogled chromium is available as an appimage and a deb
It’s a company that wants google’s spot in the ad business with a different approach, in the long run we’ll have the same shit as Google if they succeed.