Ripped from reddit
I think this story talks about it: https://people.com/kidnapped-ceo-slain-in-mountains-his-ex-employee-trial-claims-pushups-for-paychecks-11847849
Oh no! Anyway.
allegedly. maybe that millionaire just fell down an elevator shaft and onto some bullets
I don’t know why Conservatives should be worried about this, this is exactly what they want - the Free Market behaving properly.
This guy used the Free Market to operate his business on the edge of legality long enough that his behavior eventually spawned a set of employees who decided to make a correction to his “system.” Unfortunately for him, their “correction” was lethal. However, at the end of his life, I’ll bet he realized that he pushed the Free Market a little too far, and this was simply a normal correction to the Free Market.
At least the pushups worked.
I’m not… Sad. Normally I should be sad. I feel like humanity offers less and less. I cheered Luigi, and now I’m like “yeah, I get it” … wtf
It’s not you, it’s the world changing around you, or perhaps the world perceiving to change around you. I’m not sure the world has changed all that much, I think a lot of it is just us having better optics than we ever had. Rockefeller and Vanderbilt probably indirectly hurt/killed more people, but it wasn’t broadcast as easily as it is now.
In recent years we have become increasingly familiar with the thought of death. We ourselves are surprised by the composure with which we accept the news of the death of our contemporaries. We can no longer hate Death so much; we have discovered something of kindness in his features and are almost reconciled to him.
- Dietrich Bonhoeffer
Because deontology says the act of causing harm should be inherently bad, but utilitarianism says you should do what creates the most good.
I can’t side with utilitarianism for the example of killing a healthy person to harvest organs for multiple dying patients. For the powerful who gladly profit off of the suffering of millions and the destruction of our environment… it’s harder to say utilitarianism feels wrong.
Screw utilitarianism. At this point it’s fucking self defence. Either those parasites stop existing, or everyone will. They’re dead anyway, might as well save everyone else.
I don’t remember where exactly, but I’ve encountered an hybrid approach that balances utilitarianism with deontology. It goes something like this:
- Generally do what brings the most utility. But…
- People have “deontological protections” - basic human rights that you are not allowed to infringe upon even if it is for the greater good. But…
- One’s deontological protections can be bypassed if said “greater good” is solving a mess they are responsible for.
Take, for example, the case of a mass shooter. Utilitarianism says you are allowed to take them down if that’s the only way to save their victims. Naive deontology says you are not allowed to kill whatsoever. The approach I’ve just presented says that we can go with utilitarianism in this case - but only because the shooter is one responsible for this mess so it’s okay to harm them for the greater good.
Note that it does not say it’s okay to kill them otherwise. If you manage to capture them, an other lives are no longer in risk, both deontology and utilitarianism will agree you are not allowed to kill them.
Let’s go back to the classic Trolley Problem. Is the person tied to the second track responsible for the situation? No - they are a victim. They are not stripped from their deontological protection, and therefore you are not allowed to sacrifice them in order to save the other five.
Back to the case in hand. We need to ask the following questions:
- Does the suffering of the employees outweigh the life of the CEO?
- Does the death of the CEO stop the suffering of the employees?
- Is the CEO responsible for the suffering of the employees?
If the answer to all three questions is “yes” - then what’s the problem?
I can’t side with utilitarianism for the example of killing a healthy person to harvest organs for multiple dying patients.
That’s because utilitarianism has a silent other half to the problem, which is something like confidence.
Can you judge the value of one life against another? Can you do it with accurate assessment of your own perception? How much harm is introduced to the equation if you’re wrong? How likely are you wrong?
Killing one healthy person to save 5 others doesn’t meet the utilitarian standard because you’re destroying one innocent life for parts. Parts that could maybe save others… But you can put a price on organs. You can’t undo the harm of killing someone
In fact, even considering it isn’t utilitarian. The time and energy spent on weighing the value of a life vs the value of the meat should be spent on looking for solutions
Even if there is no other solution no human can truly know that…
But sometimes the numbers do become statistics. Like the trolley problem… There is a very predictable result, if you knew of a way to stop the trolley there’s no need for considering it, and you have to make a snap decision. You have to weigh their lives against each other, knowing you have limited knowledge
But the more people on one set of tracks, the easier that math becomes. There’s no line - it’s all subjective. They’re not numbers, they’re people… But the bigger the number disparity, the easier it is to answer the question
And pulling the lever is competence check too. How sure are you that you understand the situation properly? Because maybe everything is fine, and you’re about to get someone killed out of your own stupidity
And to bring it all home… One life sure as hell isn’t worth the suffering and death of tens of millions. That’s easy math.
But is the situation that simple? Would the killing of one actually save millions? I sure as hell don’t know. It’s very situational
So if someone else pulls the lever I think it’s perfectly ethical to support them, hoping that their judgement is correct, while also not being confident enough to ever pull the lever yourself
Well, the perpetrators will lose years of their lives to the prison system, that seems like some lost value.
the perpetrators will lose years of their lives to the prison system
Or enjoy a state-funded early retirement.
Prisons are not ‘retirement’ they are horrid and shitty places. I wouldn’t even want to be in a ‘luxury Norwegian prison’.
So, unions or being beaten to death.
Choose.
I mean we did used to drag them out into the street and beat them before unions. Unions are the more peaceful alternative
This is literally how it works. Ringing our hands and hoping our Israeli owned politicians will do something to help us has been destroying the country
Well I’ll never get beaten to death because I’m a fun CEO and all my employees love me, so clearly we gotta side against unions. I’ll throw a few more pizza parties to be safe.
BREAKING NEWS: “Fun” CEO beaten to death with frozen pizzas. The pizzas were delivered warm, so the police suspect premeditated intent in freezing the pizzas for use as a blunt, deadly instrument. The CEO’s customary grave-pissing will start, contingent on finding a suitable ditch.
Story here https://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/slain-calif-tech-ceo-humiliated-workers-report-21125144.php
The CEO sounded like an absolute cunt. When will they learn?
Why would they learn? There’s millions of them and they are rewarded so well for their tyranny. I think it’s time to take all of them out.
Wow.
He made them work 14 consecutive 12+ hour days of physical labour (sun up to sun down) then bounced their cheques. Then, offered $1400 ($100/day = $8/hr, well below the CA minimum wage at the time) but only if they did 300-500 push ups, while bragging he makes thousands an hour.
Jesus that guy was an absolute asshole.
Those fucking morons could have easily found a lawyer to take their case on contingency, sued him, won a ton, and probably uncovered all of his abuses, which would have led to him paying out a ton more money to present and past employees, probably bankrupting him, and very possibly putting him in prison for a few years. Far worse than death for that Putz.
Instead, they’re serving life without parole.
was
I propose a new law. If the victim of a murder is someone who owns a fortune more than 1000x the median household income, then someone on trial for the murder can make an affirmative defense that it was ok, simply because, “he needed killin.'”
Literally, if you can convince the jury that the guy had it coming, you get off Scott free. Anyone who wants to avoid potentially being killed and having their killer escape unpunished can avoid this fate by simply not hoarding wealth over the critical threshold. Those who hoard such fortunes will just have to live with enough kindness that no one could ever convince a jury that they deserved to die. We’ll end up with no billionaires or every billionaire becoming like Fred Rogers. I’ll take either outcome.
You’re describing lynching. No change in law is needed, juries are free to nullify the law. Governors and the President also have the power to pardon. It’s how the system was designed to work.
I know lemmy can lean weird left sometimes where it’s quite alright to kill someone but other physical violence, like beating somebody up, is taboo, but . . .
My dad always told me that sometimes a man just needs a tune-up. Sometimes its you, sometimes its the other guy. Maybe its both of you. When I was younger I handed out a few and received one good one of my own. I think all were probably necessary and healthy, and I am a firm believer that sometimes someone is just in need of a good ass beating to help correct their perspective.
Such a course correction, if applied earlier to this guy, might have saved his life.
I’m really starting to feel like my youngest kid is like this. But obviously I can’t tune him up myself, he’s only 6.
Can I hire some other first-grader to beat him up?
He’s a pretty solid kid…could I get a fourth-grader?
I joke…I love him but man sometimes it feels like no punishment works with him. I know that it’s really just his ADHD and him being exactly like I was as a kid…except my hyperactivity was internalized while his is externalized. Adderall helps. Both of us. Maybe I gotta see about upping his dose.
I want you to know, as a parent I understand. I love my 3 year old but he is nonstop trying to get a rise out of us.
Oh yeah that’s about the age it started in earnest with our kid. He’s like a professional troll.
Buckle up. I tried to get his older brother to hit him (back…when he hit first), but he was too much of a softie.
I’ve seen a good argument that personal violence between men may very well be mentally healthy outside of sports. Basically as you said sometimes you need your ass beat to put things into perspective, funny enough I stopped doing my twitch elbowing reaction in middle school because I did it to someone and he punched me in the face. Stopped the tic and fair is fair.
The thing that Neoliberals will grow to understand very quickly as material conditions worsen; is that FDR was not the savior of the working class. He was the savior of the capitalist FROM the working class. And right now, there isn’t an FDR to be found.
Neoliberals, and even more so social democrats, are among the most (effectively) conservative candidates in a certain sense. With the understanding that pure capitalism is so unsustainable that it will eventually destroy itself, social democrats, by undoing some of the harm caused by capitalism, only seek to conserve it.
Of course, I think they’re (social democrats, not neoliberals) a better choice for now, since they don’t work to actively harm the working class. But in the long run, they are what’s keeping capitalism afloat. I don’t know what’s the way to escape the clutches of capitalism without causing complete societal collapse, but social democracy ain’t it.
Social democrats in the West managed to keep capitalism afloat because the brunt of the exploitation was moved abroad.
Yeah, that’s a critical difference between social democracy and true socialism. Socialists are against exploitation anywhere in the world.
Honestly, I consider myself a social democrat, and that’s a fair criticism of social democratic politics.
You can mitigate the worst excesses of capitalism, but only at the price of constant vigilance. And if you do a good job, people don’t think you are doing much of anything, and hound you about the “government inefficiency”, the “oppressive regulatory pressure” and the “poor business climate”. You are basically running PR for capitalism.
The new wave of DSA-aligned progressives are running on an FDR inspired “Green New Deal.” If they get enough victories in next year’s primaries there could be a realignment of the DNC towards FDR style policies, so there very well could be an FDR type running in the 2028 presidential election with the support of the Democratic party. The wealthy donors who control the DNC would be forced to appease the base
It’s likely to be a very chaotic affair given Trump’s unwillingness to abdicate power. Unfortunately the only way I see trump leaving office peacefully is if his own party turns on him and votes along with Democrats to impeach him before the next election. Failing that we’ll get Jan 6 two: electric boogaloo and we get to find out if they worked out the kinks.
He could leave in a box
I support DSA because I think it builds class consciousness and can show on a small scale what socialist policies can achieve.
However, I think the capitalist class has made it clear that they would not allow an FDR to save them. They turned down that offer with Bernie and again letting Biden run for a second term. They decided it was gonna be more neoliberalism or a Cryptofascist surrounded by actual fascist at every level of his administration.
You are right. They will not give up power. And they definitely won’t allow an FDR candidate in though. And if they do they definitely won’t allow the level of FDR policies needed to stop the anger of the working class.
The failing neoliberalism vs. growing fascism is the only real federal government cycle we have to look forward to. Eventually that hits it tipping point though.
However, I think the capitalist class has made it clear that they would not allow an FDR to save them. They turned down that offer with Bernie and again letting Biden run for a second term.
They’re just not desperate enough yet. They will cave when they begin to feel they are under personal threat.
We’ll have to agree to disagree. In my opinion you can’t “unchoose” fascism.
And nobody will miss him.
Almost sounds like my current employer. The concept surely is the same. Workplace Enshittification.
The CEO certainly was asking for it it seems
Did you see what they were wearing?!?
Yeah and only halfway into the article it revealed that he had a “marijuana enterprise”… So, slice it as you will, but he was a drug dealer. Maybe a very clean legit operation, but still a drug dealer…
Employees did the world a favor.
I feel like I would have nullified, had I been on the jury.
Fucker got “the Luigi”.
Or is it “got Luigi’d”?
I actually don’t like that. As far as I know Luigi is innocent.
I’d find this guy innocent too.
He got weegee’d
I like the term “blue shelled” as it’s someone near last place targeting someone in first.
Hah good one.
Kinda dumb, but I like it.
Love it.
Lol accurate af though
Reminds me that Luigi day is tomorrow.
Yes.
No notes.
Cool. More stories like this please.
