• Ulair
    link
    fedilink
    8610 months ago

    From his responses you can see reddit will continue their path. and if you think about it, everything is going well for them.

    the probability that a critical mass of users will leave is still quite low. they will get rid of a lot of moderators that don’t fall in line. what is left will be a community that won’t mind the direction reddit is going.

    reddit will turn boring, but the shareholders won’t care. as long as they manage to keep enough users after the api change the site will recover.

    the only positive thing here is that a lot of dedicated people may join other platforms and start building new communities.

    • @jack@compuverse.uk
      link
      fedilink
      2210 months ago

      I just find the whole thing really false and shut off.

      The answers provided by spez are completely useless and don’t really further any discussion. This is all about damage control for the upcoming IPO in my opinion. Without users, active moderators and people willing to engage and discuss… the product is going to burn at IPO.

      Here’s hoping enough people can get into some simple Lemmy instances and help the 'verse grow. Time for me to find communities for LEGO and watches!

    • @annenas@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      1910 months ago

      That’s what I expected as well. My guess is that it’s mostly somewhat tech savvy people that care about the changes. The more casual users will probably keep using reddit. Basically the lifecycle of most social media tbh

      • Skelectus
        link
        fedilink
        1210 months ago

        Yeah. I doubt there will be any mass migration. Instead, we’ll have a few high quality users, which in my opinion is the best case.

        • @annenas@beehaw.org
          link
          fedilink
          1410 months ago

          Yeah, I actually don’t mind the smaller user base. Although it looks like I’ll have to miss out on a few things (r/HistoricalCostuming and r/FashionHistory users don’t seem to be here yet in substantial numbers, for example). So long as we’re all excellent to each other it’s all good though (:

          Party on dudes

          • maya 🫐
            link
            fedilink
            610 months ago

            @annenas Really hoping that the userbase may spread out a bit, too. It’s awesome that we’ve had v. techy early adopters but I’m really looking forward to other folks maybe coming on board

            • MyNameIsFred
              link
              fedilink
              210 months ago

              agree. I am hoping the federated instances wont be overwhelming for folks.

      • chillybones
        link
        fedilink
        810 months ago

        I would venture a guess the more casual user’s window into this is only the handful of posts on Reddit that bubble to the top of r/all of third party apps shutting down. If they are uses of those apps, they probably scroll right on by and are none the wiser about the larger implications of all of this. And why should they care? If it doesn’t directly affect the way they use the platform, they will never even feel the impact of this.

    • @Dalek@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      1110 months ago

      Yeah. It’s like a toxic workplace. The old dogs might leave but those who hate change or new guys who don’t know how it used to be will stay

    • GraceGH
      link
      fedilink
      510 months ago

      Hilariously, it appears he’s copying from a list of precanned responses. It’s been fun reddit.

    • jdp23
      link
      fedilink
      310 months ago

      Agreed all around … although I’d add that the probability that a critical mass of users will leave is quite low in the short term.

    • @unsunny@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      3410 months ago

      Probably the thing that disgusts me the most in all this is how spez has been constantly trying to drag Christian Selig’s name through the mud when it’s crystal clear that he (spez) is the problem.

      Love to see the downvotes; wonder if he’ll beat out EA’s legendary disaster.

    • kitonthenet
      link
      fedilink
      2610 months ago

      #1 sin to corporate America is recording ur conversations lol, dude is pissed there’s audio

      • MyNameIsFred
        link
        fedilink
        1410 months ago

        Anything that ensures accountability, especially personal accountability is looked at negatively. Its not an american thing uniquely. But it is embraced, especially in the last 20 years by companies. Its why general support is so poor, especially technical support.

      • @liara@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        1010 months ago

        Yeah how DARE he look out for his rights and protect himself by knowing what he’s legally allowed to do! Don’t you know, this is America where corporate interests trump individual rights?

        Oh wait, you’re from Canada? Shit.

        (Just kidding, in Canada, corps fuck us just as hard, if not harder)

        • Mars
          link
          fedilink
          510 months ago

          (Just kidding, in Canada, corps fuck us just as hard, if not harder)

          Ain’t that the truth. Just look at the cartel that is the telecom companies.

    • x-ray
      link
      fedilink
      1210 months ago

      This really makes me want Reddit to sink fast. Disgusting behavior.

  • @Arystique@beehaw.org
    link
    fedilink
    5210 months ago

    Tbh

    HOW THE FUCK DID I OVERESTIMATE SPEZ

    The fucking bar was on the ground and he didn’t pass it what the hell

    • @bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      610 months ago

      The bar was on the ground but you didn’t suspect he had descended into the underworld. For all the questions he dodged, one of the only ones he actually answered was trying to commit to the lies he’s been telling about the appollo dev, even after the leaked phone call audio proves it is a lie

        • @bionicjoey@lemmy.ca
          link
          fedilink
          110 months ago

          Basically there was a miscommunication on a phone call between Reddit and the Apollo dev where they briefly misconstrued something the Apollo dev said as “threatening” Reddit. The miscommunication was cleared up instantly and amicably in the moment, but then spez went out and started claiming that the Apollo dev had been threatening Reddit and acting in bad faith. The Apollo dev responded by releasing an audio recording of the entire phone conversation (lol) which made it abundantly clear that Reddit were trying to attack his character.

  • @Manticore@beehaw.org
    link
    fedilink
    34
    edit-2
    10 months ago

    I understand that Reddit needs to monetise. It’s not a link aggregate site anymore, hosting video/image files is expensive, Reddit operates at a loss and the 3p users cost them even more. They have reason to be dismayed that they operate at a loss while 3p apps using their API do not.

    And I understand their concern with adult content. They can’t control if 3p apps will display it with or without checks, but Reddit hosts it; limiting it on 3p apps is probably the better choice to them than removing it from their site entirely. After all, they’re operating at a loss; they can’t afford the fines and fees. Sexual content is heavily legislated.

    But goddamn. Limited negotiation with devs, adversarial communication (to the point of outright animosity), frankly absurd timeframe, the use of accessibility as negotiation for the blackout… there’s no good faith anymore.

    Reddit is user-generated. The users are the content, their engagement is Reddit’s product. Users that don’t want to engage with their platform give them less sellable product. The users that engage the most (commenting, contributing, moderating) are the minority, and also the ones most likely to use 3p tools.

    Reddit has good grounds for wanting to monetise. There are good reasons for bringing devs to the plate about how to do that. Devs were readily agreeing to covering their costs in calls, and expecting to negotiate what the revenue margin should be. Mutually equitable arrangement.

    But this was handled so fucking badly, communicated so fucking badly (by one of the devs too tbh), that an equitable arrangement cannot possibly be reached anymore. Nobody wants to bargain in good faith anymore.

    Now all the users want Reddit to cancel all the changes, publicly apologise, and remain operating a loss. Now Reddit wants devs to shut up and pay up, and blame them for the situation they’re in.

    Now everybody loses, because devs close apps, high-activity users contribute less or outright leave, and Reddit decays down into a pit of low-interaction lurkers picking over ad-bleached bones, until it’s considered so unprofitable and unrecoverable that it is shut down entirely.

  • alyaza [they/she]M
    link
    fedilink
    3110 months ago

    so far the AMA has been up for about 20 minutes, and he’s answered 3 questions. heavily downvoted as expected.

    • @luna@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      4410 months ago

      And he’s already started with the personal attacks against Christian Selig, the Apollo author. Already. Barely 10 minutes into the AMA and he’s already personally attacking someone. What a piece of shit.

      • alyaza [they/she]M
        link
        fedilink
        2110 months ago

        you’re almost certainly going to have to browse by his profile just to see, given how nuclear the reaction against him is.

        • Lodion 🇦🇺
          link
          fedilink
          1210 months ago

          Every response of his has been downvoted to oblivion. The community has made their thoughts on him loud and clear.

          • Somewhiteguy
            link
            fedilink
            1310 months ago

            I’m sure the stockholders he’s been pandering to will love investing in a company that has a user base that so vehemently hates the CEO. I’m not sure where you put that on the financial sheet, but it’s going to be interesting to see how this affects it going public.

            • @Jeroen@lemmy.cock.social
              link
              fedilink
              710 months ago

              World of Warcraft players hate Bobby Kotick, yet he’s still the CEO of Activision Blizzard and earning a ridiculous amount of money for his next yacht.

              • Ulu-Mulu-no-die
                link
                fedilink
                110 months ago

                So true lol, we’re all hoping Microsoft will kick him out if/when the acquisition is finalized.

            • alyaza [they/she]M
              link
              fedilink
              710 months ago

              I’m sure the stockholders he’s been pandering to will love investing in a company that has a user base that so vehemently hates the CEO.

              in fairness: hasn’t this generally been true of the site since Victoria was fired? my general perception is this is just the last straw for a lot of people, but that people who care about the site’s ownership at all have pretty consistently despised ownership for years now

              • Somewhiteguy
                link
                fedilink
                810 months ago

                That’s true. Since the site became a “company” people have begun hating the direction it has been going. I have an 11 year account that is my second after deleting my first account that was around since the beginning of the site. I’ve seen sites come and go. This is just the end of another in the long history of the internet.

  • @z2k_@lemmy.nz
    link
    fedilink
    3010 months ago

    To me it sounds like this AMA is more to appease the mod community. The relationship with 3rd party app developers is already in the mud and they are fine with that but they can’t lose their mods if they want Reddit to continue to function.

    In saying that, he’s doing an awful job and is making things worse. :popcorn:

    • @RedPander@lemmy.rogers-net.com
      link
      fedilink
      1510 months ago

      They definitely know that if enough Mod’s jump ship then their communities will suffer heavily. I’m going to guess that we’ll see quite a few quit. There will be some that stick around holding on by their fingertips to for communities based around helping others.

      But most mods aren’t going to be willing to put in extra free labor especially for a company that keep signalling with actions that helping them isn’t a priority.

      • @jiji@beehaw.org
        link
        fedilink
        1210 months ago

        Especially when losing 3rd party apps loses them a lot of mod and bot tools/support. The power hungry mods will stay but those that were just doing it to be helpful are gonna feel burned.

        • @RedPander@lemmy.rogers-net.com
          link
          fedilink
          910 months ago

          Exactly. Probably going to be some rot in the communities. I wouldn’t be surprised if a few months from now we see Reddit offering more incentives to be a mod in order to entice others to take up the reigns.

  • iNeedScissors67
    link
    fedilink
    2910 months ago

    So the Now for Reddit creator says he’s been flat-out ignored for 3 months and he’s panicking, he doesn’t want to lose 10 years of work. Spez replies "Apologies for the delay. We are responding now.

    If others have apps they would like to be considered for the paid API tier, please reach out here and select “This is a partnership request.”

    The sheer incompetence of this man, holy shit.

    • @annenas@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      2710 months ago

      That one rubbed me the wrong way too. On one hand they’re trying to convince everyone that their announcements gave devs plenty of time to adapt, but on the other they’re ignoring the devs that want to cooperate. There’s no way that response backlog is 3 months long.

    • @annenas@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      310 months ago

      That one rubbed me the wrong way too. On one hand they’re trying to convince everyone that their announcements gave devs plenty of time to adapt, but on the other they’re ignoring the devs that want to cooperate. There’s no way that response backlog is 3 months long.

  • @luna@beehaw.org
    link
    fedilink
    2810 months ago

    Looks like spez is done with the AMA. His responses constitute 0.07% of comments in the thread.

      • @plactagonic@beehaw.org
        link
        fedilink
        1410 months ago

        Few political not answers, some f-you answers, personal attack to Christian.

        I would say that PR was disastrous, people rage that he wasn’t prepared for obvious questions and 0 informational value of this AMA.

  • Dessalines
    link
    fedilink
    2610 months ago

    Effective July 1, 2023, the rate for apps that require higher usage limits is $0.24 per 1K API calls (less than $1.00 per user / month for a typical Reddit third-party app).

    Effectively forcing app devs to become middle-men collecting on reddit’s behalf. Mob boss behavior. ’

    I guess it “looks better”, to cut someone off at the knees before murdering them outright.

    • @teruma@beehaw.org
      link
      fedilink
      1010 months ago

      It’s not murder if food is suddenly eleventy bazillion dollars and you starve to death, unless you’re irish.

      • Dessalines
        link
        fedilink
        910 months ago

        They really love pulling the “stop hitting yourself!” thing that bullies do don’t they.

  • @shufflerofrocks@beehaw.org
    link
    fedilink
    2510 months ago

    He’s said four things in response to questions - every one of which is a deflecting non-answer and one of which is a personal attack. Lol. What a surprise

  • mint
    link
    fedilink
    2310 months ago

    My only thought about this is that I wish people would stop using awards on comments lol. You’re giving the site money! Feel like I gotta spray users with a water bottle like no, no, stop that

    • goji
      link
      fedilink
      2110 months ago

      I mean, I have a stockpile of 8000 “free” coins to get rid of before I nuke my account. Might as well go towards depriving reddit of ad revenue.

    • Danacus
      link
      fedilink
      1210 months ago

      Could be that people already have these awards and since they might want to leave reddit, they just give those awards to random comments from the CEO. Probably unlikely, but who knows?

      • mint
        link
        fedilink
        510 months ago

        I do know that part of it is that giving awards helps surface comments getting heavily downvoted in the algo, but no amount of awards is going to help you see spez - the downvote avalanche is gonna be nonstop lol

    • atocci
      link
      fedilink
      810 months ago

      Using up free coins doesn’t give them any more money though, right? I just checked and I apparently have 550 coins to “spend”.

      • @saigot@lemmy.ca
        link
        fedilink
        910 months ago

        It doesn’t but it gives the illusion that people are spending money on these things, and gives credibility to marketing teams raining awards on comments that they want to promote.

        When more than gold first came out the primary response to awards was disgust and disdain, giving out a butt load of free coins normalizes the awards and makes them more palatable.

    • quizzicl
      link
      fedilink
      610 months ago

      Don’t mind me, I’m just using up my stockpile of randomly earned coins. I won’t be paying Reddit anything.

    • Powderhorn
      link
      fedilink
      210 months ago

      I hope spez isn’t a cat. Mine flees when she sees me pick up the water bottle and is back up to no good as soon as I turn around.

  • @RedPander@lemmy.rogers-net.com
    link
    fedilink
    20
    edit-2
    10 months ago

    Based on the answers I’m seeing, I’m positive that this change is a result of changing for their IPO. Lots of none answers, but they also aren’t backing down on the absurd pricing.

    Having been a manager at a Fortune 500 and getting announcements from Executive level leadership / giving announcements to my reports, this is surprisingly the level of competence I would expect.

    Unfortunate, but also a symptom of Reddit being too big for the team to handle. The outflux of users caused by this might actually -help- Reddit in terms of figuring out their revenue stream and getting better leadership.

    Sad to see this happening in real time though.

  • @courts@feddit.de
    link
    fedilink
    2010 months ago

    Really funny how searching for “Lemmy” in the thread just turns up… Nothing. I wonder why.

    • iNeedScissors67
      link
      fedilink
      1510 months ago

      Someone in another thread here said something mentioning Lemmy got them a shadowban

      • boxys
        link
        fedilink
        910 months ago

        Almost as though they’re scared that Lemmy could actually be a threat… I kinda love it…

        • @PascalPistachios@beehaw.org
          link
          fedilink
          4
          edit-2
          10 months ago

          Just like Twitter banning any mention of mastodon. They can’t rely on keeping the product, users, on the site with a good website. So they just prolong the inevitable and do whatever they can to stop people from leaving. Enshittification, my beloathed.